Nassau And Suffolk County NY Red Light Cameras

The Facebook group for my area has been lit up for weeks now on the subject of the speed camera here in Glen Head. Apparently the newest issue is incorrectly flagging cars as speeding. The county had stated that you get a 10 MPH grace on the speed limit. The school zone limit on Glen Cove Avenue is 25 MPH but people have been receiving tickets for 31-34 MPH. So now we have the ambiguity of not knowing exactly what the grace is. Since the normal limit is 30 MPH, 31-34 MPH would be over anyhow. I have to wonder if the threshold is 10 MPH over or exceeding the normal speed limit, which ever is lower.

to many camera I just drive with my eyes close to ignore them lol

By New York State law, the threshold is 10 mph over the school speed limit, so for a 25 mph zone the tickets are illegal from 26 through 34 mph.

dobs108

Sounds like these folks are going to have to take a day off from work and go to court to fight. I am guessing they just hope people will pay up and forget about it. As such, I will have to treat all these zones as having no leeway at all lest I too have to make a trip to traffic court. It is nice of the folks running the cameras to provide you with the measured speed. Even if it means you should not have gotten the ticket.

Probably no different then the ambiguous time you are supposed to wait before making a right on red.

Today's (12/4/14) Newsday reports that the County Executive is cutting the hours that school zone speed cameras will operate. The school zone hours are set by the local town or village and are typically 7 AM to 6 PM. The new hours of enforcement are 7 AM to 9 AM and 2 PM to 4 PM.

It is shocking news that they would consider doing this.

The article includes some financial data showing that the speed camera program has provided the county with an embarrassment of riches! The county received $16.6 million from September through November when on average, fewer than one quarter of the planned cameras were operating.

Even considering a 70% reported drop in violations after drivers became aware of the cameras, the revenue is much higher than planned. If the program continues full-blown into the future, the yearly total would be many times higher than they expected. This means voters are paying big-time, and this issue has motivated them to take action more than any other in the past. The county officials' political careers will be over and they know it.

Weeks ago the minority party in the county legislature had called for the speed camera program to be suspended, and with this announcement about the high revenue, the majority leader just called for the same thing.

Some will say that all those drivers deserve the fines. Things are different now from when I walked to school a half-mile (uphill both ways). For many locations, the school zone speed limit is a relic of that bygone era. Kids arrive on buses unloaded on school property, or in their parents' cars. In visits to speed camera locations, I have seen a complete lack of kids near the road or crossing it. The school zone speed camera program is a solution in search of a problem.

dobs108

Seeing how much money they have raked in already, it is possible they realized that leaving it alone would really raise some eyebrows. If the numbers stick, it I believe it was $12.5 million in three months, that are looking at $48 million in a year.

On their other comment, I do agree the minimum speed limit needs to be set at 25MPH. 15 or 20 MPH limits are ridiculous.

Sunday 12/7/14 Newsday had no fewer than three speed camera stories, including Joye Brown's column entitled, "A speedy demise for school cams?" She states, "(the county executive) also had received a warning from Nassau (Majority) Party officials. 'It was made clear to the county executive that the speed cameras were toxic,' one said."

She goes on to specify that they are not toxic to the county executive who has three more years on his term, but for the entire county legislature who are up for re-election next year.

It is unknown how they would replace the revenue from the cameras.

Joye Brown's opinions are always clearly written, using common sense and a great deal of insight, and I think her prediction is correct.

dobs108

just read an article stating that suffolk county is no longer considering using speed cameras next year. I guess all the political uproar in nassau has scared the hell out suffolk politicians.

Interesting, can you please post a link or advise where you read that.

It was on Long Island News12 that had the Suffolk Exect. on TV that their will be no speed cameras at the schools next year.

Also Nassau is shutting down their speed cameras.

That's what happens when people get up from their behinds and tell the politicans what they think and will be when the next vote comes up for them.

Newsday online. Sorry - no link because Newsday is a pay site.

"Suffolk County Executive (xxxxxxx) announced Monday he will kill the county's school speed camera program, as the (majority party) legislative leader in Nassau said she would file legislation Tuesday to end that county's program."

dobs108

Thanks to all POI Factory contributors! You have done it! Your hard work has killed the speed camera program in both Nassau and Suffolk!

dobs108

Just like red light cameras... it's all about the money!!

Nuvi1300WTGPS

Happy to hear Suffolk will not install the speed cameras and Nassau hopefully will approve the shutting down of their program.

If Nassau shuts down, the Speed Camera file will need some serious editing. Also we would need to delete members ciarmer's Nassau County Mobile Speed Camera Locations file. He put a lot of work into it but I'm sure he'll be relieved of not having to maintain it.

Well the legislative leader is introducing legislation to shut the program down BUT it could be vetoed by Mangano. The question is will this resolution pass with a veto proof majority? Mangano is not facing re-election in 2015 but the legislature is making them more receptive to repeal. Also, if the program is shut down, ATS will get a $3M fee from the county (which I suppose they could take out of the fines they have collected so far).

I am glad Suffolk has nixed the program. As I have mentioned in previous posts, the Great South Bay School on Great East Neck Road in West Babylon is an excellent trap and could have paid the county budget in one year.

Thanks for posting the latest Mobile Speed Cameras Nassau file. There is no predicting what Nassau might do next, so this must be done.

dobs108

I suspect it will. Both parties in the legislature are opposed to the program at this point, and I can't imagine running next November with a pro-camera vote on their record.

We have prepared an updated POI file containing mobile speed camera locations in Nassau County. The file now contains 25 mobile speed camera locations (covering 24 schools). All of the locations have signs warning of photo/video enforcement.

Here is the link to the file:

http://www.poi-factory.com/node/43581

The new file includes a new location (North Side School in East Williston - thanks dobs108 for pointing this one out!). In addition, it was noticed recently that Dutch Lane E.S. in Hicksville actually has photo enforcement signs on Stewart Avenue as well as Levittown Parkway so an additional waypoint was added for this school.

If you know of other locations that you think should be added to this file, please post the information (school name, street and town) and we will work to get it updated as soon as possible.

Be on the lookout for other locations. With several of the locations currently in the file, the mobile speed camera van has actually been spotted on site at school speed zones. dobs108 has described this van in previous posts.

An analysis of crash data published by Newday on 12/10/14 shows that Nassau County chose speed camera locations without regard to data on all auto accidents, available from the State of New York, as required by law.

Newsday asserts that there were no speed-related accidents in the last five years during typical school zone hours at 57 of the 76 locations for speed cameras in Nassau. The 19 other camera locations had a total of 23 speed-related crashes in five years. In my opinion, 23 speed-related crashes hardly demonstrates the need for a speed camera program in the first place.

Newsday goes on to say that public officials involved in creating the speed camera program, the state legislators, the governor, the county legislators, and the county executive, failed to study crash data anytime in the entire process. No documents exist to show that crash data was considered at all.

A study was published after the introduction of Nassau speed cameras by the Tri-State Transportation Campaign, a known advocate for speed camera legislation. Newsday says that the Tri-State study report asserts that "nearly 40 percent of the county's 37 fatal pedestrian accidents happened within a quarter-mile of a school - the maximum size of a school zone allowed under the law." However, that was measured by a quarter-mile radius, not along the road inside a school zone.

Newsday’s "along the road" analysis shows that, in five years there was only one fatal accident in Nassau inside a school zone during typical school zone hours and that one was not speed-related. A 90 year old woman was killed when she drove off the roadway into a tree.

Some schools are within a quarter-mile of a busy, dangerous road such as Hempstead Turnpike, where there are many fatal accidents, but there are no school zones and no speed cameras located where the fatalities happened. Nevertheless the Tri-State report has been cited by Nassau officials in defense of accusations by residents that there was never any safety problem in school zones prior to the introduction of speed cameras in their neighborhoods.

Newsday is to be commended for publishing its analysis of crash data.

dobs108

Just a rip off

From Newsday.com

Thanks to dobs108 for posting this! Great information.

Our politicians seem to consistently act in a manner that is contrary to the will of the people they were elected to represent. And they often do it by trying to convince us with bogus statistical "evidence".

This sounds like wonderful news!!

Does it really mean that these infernal and ridiculous caravans of slow moving vehicles will disappear starting Tuesday (12/16/14)??

I can't wait to see how they make up for the revenue loss. But I can guarantee that there will be no attempt made to reduce spending in any part of their bloated budget.

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/nassau-legislature...

We have cause to celebrate! Thanks, ciarmer for the praise but do not discard the Mobile Speed Cameras Nassau file just yet. The unanimous vote of the Nassau legislature to end the speed camera program may advance the plans of the architect of the speed camera program, State Senator Jeffrey Klein (Bronx). I believe that he only intended the school speed camera program to be a stepping stone to speed cameras everywhere!

Newsday has shown that there never was a safety problem in Nassau County school zones, but they have campaigned for years about dangerous roads such as the Southern State Parkway and Hempstead Turnpike (among many others), where regular fatalities have been publicized and ignored by residents. I am not sure I would be an advocate against speed cameras properly directed at those locations.

The next step for Sen. Klein would be to design a speed camera law that leaves Nassau (and Suffolk) politicians out of the loop. What speed camera advocate can depend on their resolve?

Stay tuned!

dobs108

I noticed the signs indicating video enforcement for the speed zones was pulled almost immediately. Not that they had that many sites to deal with. I would be curious to see if the cameras stay up for any length of time or if they get pulled. ATS might be hoping to get them resurrected.

On the downside, it looks like the county, in order to make up that lost revenue, wants to increase various fees including the 911 phone surcharge from around $.33 to $1 a month. Of course it has nothing to do with 911 service but simply more money to pay off the debt the county incurred when it dropped the salary freeze. They still have to pay the $30 million to the county workforce and they will need recurring revenue to cover that plus hikes that I am sure coming with new contract negotiations. Frankly I see no other solution for Nassau except an income tax like Yonkers has. And, to really stick it to the taxpayers and let them know what they are really worth, I would exempt ALL county workers from the tax. Otherwise they will demand raises to cover that tax which in turn will raise all the taxes again to pay for it. Wash, rinse, repeat...

Revenue from Automated Traffic Enforcement comes only from those who are alleged to have broken the law.

From the its beginning until its untimely end, the Nassau speed camera program never gained the support of residents because, in their perception, they disagree with jgermann's statement. There were too many examples of drivers entrapped by unfair and even illegal procedures.

Cameras were turned on in summer when no one was aware that summer school was in session. When school is closed the school speed limit is not in effect. All the school calendars were blank for the summer! I began calling the schools and found that summer school was actually not in session at many locations and schools were closed on days the county said they were open. If the county cannot determine when school is open then how can drivers do so?

I called county officials and the local newspaper. It was determined that 25% of the tickets were invalid because school was closed. With the resulting publicity, the county executive cancelled all tickets issued in the summer.

The cameras were turned on again in September. I visited many locations to make reports for the POI Factory speed camera file. I found that at most locations the school speed limit signs did not comply with the law. A driver ticketed by a police officer can be found innocent in court if the signs are defective, but the low fine from a speed camera ticket ($80-) would preclude going to court. (Do you remember Baltimore officials speaking about this issue?) Even today, almost every school zone has some defect in its signs.

I found that many signs did not include the hours the speed limit is in effect. After more newspaper publicity, the county began posting these signs even though it is not in their jurisdiction, but the local government. They posted signs in an unprofessional manner. They went too far and posted hours for locations where there are flashing yellow lights. This is not legal.

At the few locations with flashing yellow lights, the school speed limit is in effect only when the lights are on. The law requires the school to operate the lights only at times when needed. Prior to speed cameras, the flashing yellow lights were being operated properly. After the speed cameras arrived, school personnel stated that the county insisted the lights operate all day long even though they were not needed. This is in violation of the law.

Finally, there is the question of credibility. I have found, and local news media has found, that the county has continually made statements later proven false, when the truth would have served as well. When they were accused of operating speed cameras in violation of the law they would make any excuse to silence their critics.

Any contributors who want to engage in discussion on Nassau speed cameras should read the entire thread. Even though much local information is in it, it has not been possible to include everything. For example, the number of newspaper articles on this subject is now more than 100. And no, I cannot back up my statements with an internet link. Some facts exist only in the real world!

dobs108

Now that the speed camera issue has been put to rest, any updates on the roll out of red light cameras? I've been watching the intersection of NY-109 and Wellwood Avenue (CR-3) in North Lindenhurst. It is getting a brand spanking new traffic light installation complete with new polls and wiring, and would appear to be a good candidate for RLC's. Just a mile south there is an RLC at NY-109 and Straight Path (CR-2) which is an intersection of similar characteristics. The latter intersection had newer equipment which may be why it got the RLC's early on.

Regardless I am happy to not have to add speed cameras to my POI's!

Happy New Year!

The legislators were for it before they were against it. Where have we seen that before?

Both counties have kept quiet about any new red light cameras. Look at the mess Nassau made of public statements about speed cameras. Suffolk may have been thinking about changing vendors for more revenue, but that was related to the possibility of speed cameras.

Contracts for new traffic light installation probably would now include provision for red light cameras. The most important parts are more extensive vehicle-detection loops in the roadway and additional underground conduit. They are less expensive when a new installation is made.

This work is very visible and we should keep watching at those locations for the actual camera. They saw-cut the roadway in the traffic lanes in front of the stop line and dig trenches from corner to corner which are repaired with asphalt.

dobs108

Has anyone seen contractors removing any Nassau school zone speed cameras? I haven't.

If I were ATS, this is what I would do:

1) Leave all the equipment in place while lobbying public officials to reactivate the new, improved, speed camera system.

2) Do a traffic study to prove that vehicle speeds have skyrocketed since the cameras were turned off. This can easily be done because the equipment is still turned on. It is just not issuing tickets. The problem is that the people in Arizona don't know when school is closed. Due to this year's calendar the Christmas vacation was two weeks. They also don't know when spring break is.

3) Wait until Nassau installs "when flashing" lights at all speed camera locations.

4) The target for reactivation is after election day, November 2015.

It is true that ATS would receive payments specified in its contract for return of their capital investment plus penalties for cancelling the program, but they want to keep doing speed camera business in Nassau into the future.

You heard it here first!

dobs108

Just the video enforcement signs. They disappeared almost within 24 hours of the repeal. The camera by North Shore High School is still in place. I tend to agree that they will probably be left in place pending a change of heart by the legislature. I doubt the state legislature is going to repeal the law thus giving Nassau and Suffolk a chance to change their minds at some future date.

There is a RLC on northbound Route 110 (aka Broad Hollow Rd) at the southeast intersection with I-495 service road in Huntington, Suffolk County, NY. It is in operation and has been so for several weeks but is not in the file.

There may be a RLC for southbound Route 110 at the northwest intersection, but I am not sure.

The above has been reported to Globe Turtle.

Thanks, perpster! That location is now in the file. I was there yesterday and the alert worked fine. There is no camera at 110 and the North Service Road.

dobs108

On Wednesday the new lights at NY-109 and CR-3 and the old lights removed. Much to my surprise, there is no RLC installation despite the upgraded equipment. These new lights are quite interesting. They all have solid rectangular outlines with yellow trim to make them stand out. Plus there are so many lights facing in each direction that you just about see a bar of red light as you approach the intersection. I am guessing this is a new style traffic light design to grab the attention of the drivers. I have not seen an intersection so well "lit up" like this one. I always thought Old Country Road and Merrick Road was well covered but this new lighting has that one beat.

You're very welcome.

The state is using them at some spots on Route 110 in the new construction north of the LIE, near the NSP. They may be new to NY, but they've been used in California for decades.

There are reports that new "flashing lights" school speed limit signs are being installed at fixed and mobile speed camera locations. They include the optional "your speed" display.

We have not heard that any speed cameras have been removed as of 2/27/15. This means they are coming back!

Newsday reports (no link because Newsday is a pay site) that the Village of Malverne Police Department has written tickets for Nassau County mobile speed camera vans illegally parked in front of Malverne High School last September.

Newsday columnist Judy Cartwright had made Freedom of Information requests for the tickets, which were finally turned over. She says village officials refused to answer questions about the tickets.

The tickets were issued to vans owned by American Traffic Solutions. Many of the vans are registered in Arizona.

Parking is at a premium at all Nassau County high schools because many students do not take the bus to school and drive their cars instead. Those students not complying with the rules of the school must park on the street. By the time the speed camera van arrives, all legal parking spaces are occupied.

Turnabout is fair play!

dobs108

Amen Brother!

Malverne Village police ticketed Nassau speed camera vans
March 18, 2015 by CELESTE HADRICK / celeste.hadrick@newsday.com

Last fall when Nassau’s school-zone speed cameras were infuriating drivers from Massapequa to Great Neck, rumors abounded that Malverne police had done a turnabout on the county by issuing village parking tickets to the county’s mobile speed camera vans.

The speed camera program snapped photos of cars speeding in school zones and issued motorists $80 tickets for each infraction — $50 for violating the school speed limit and $30 for the county administrative fee.

At the time, Malverne’s police chief, mayor and village clerk did not return multiple calls from Newsday asking about the rumored tickets.

But Newsday’s Judy Cartwright recently received copies of the Malverne tickets in response to a Freedom of Information request to the county for email correspondence about the speed camera program, which was disbanded in December because of intense driver outrage. The program's vendor, American Traffic Solutions, had requested by email a copy of the parking summonses.

The correspondence indicates that Malverne police issued three tickets on Sept. 8 to the same county speed camera van for parking in “no parking” areas or for overtime parking along Ocean Avenue outside Malverne High School. A village officer issued another ticket on Sept. 9 to the same van for parking by a “no parking” sign outside the Malverne Middle School at the corner of Ocean Avenue and Aberdeen Street. Each ticket carried a fine of $30.

John Marks, executive director of the county's Traffic and Parking Violations Agency, said Wednesday that the tickets had been dismissed. When asked whether the county had to pay the $30 adminstrative fee, he said, "Malverne Court does not have a $30 driver responsibility fee."

Next time the county will have to issue special county plates to keep them from getting ticketed. Granted it probably would not be necessary if the courts continue to dismiss the tickets but it would cut down on useless overhead of writing the ticket, doing all the clerical work and actually holding court only to dump them in the trash.

There has been a lot of publicity recently about the possible return of Nassau County speed cameras. There is a website dedicated to protesting their use:

http://www.nassauspeedcameras.com/

The site is very good, but one limitation is that the many links to Newsday.com stories cannot be seen by people who are not paid subscribers to Newsday.

I have contacted the operator of the site to suggest he ask Newsday's permission to post these stories on the nassauspeedcameras site.

dobs108

These going to be placed in the general RLC & SPEED CAM files and distributed via the normal 2 files?

All of them were already in the speed camera file, but they were taken out on December 16, 2014 when the county discontinued the program. All the cameras are still there in good operating condition. If the county reactivates them, we will put them back in the file.

dobs108

Dobbs

I would vote to keep them in the file now. Never know when the county will flip the switch back on, under the radar. I'd rather get the warning than not. That way, I can make the choice to alter speed or not. Just thinking out loud.

There is a new red light camera being installed in Nassau County at Jericho Turnpike (rt 25) and South Oyster Bay Road in Syosset. Jackson Avenue is north of the intersection and South Oyster Bay Road is south.

Once it is completed, I will report the coordinates.

This camera will be a real moneymaker! The intersection is a real problem in the late afternoon with horn-blowing traffic jams on both streets. I expect the camera to make things worse.

dobs108