Intermediate VIA Waypoints not automatically sequencing during active trip with multiple waypoints

 

Hello,

I am learning to make technical routes using basecamp and Harley Rider for motorcycling. I want to build solid routes that will not change during transfer to devices and will work as expected so that I can enjoy the passing scenery rather than be distracted by the GPS recalculating my route unexpectedly.

I have noticed that many times my intermediate enroute waypoints are not captured and my GPS is trying to re-route me back to a missed point that I have just passed.

It seems that the slower my speed at the time of reaching the waypoint(like an intersection where I have stopped for a sign or light), the more likely the route will not sequence to the next waypoint automatically, nor in a timely manner so that I can get a heads up to what is coming next. Instead, I must manually select the next waypoint.

Does anyone know if the faster your actual speed, the wider the "waypoint capture net?"

If the waypoint area expands with increasing approach speed, I would love to learn the formula used to better anticipate the problem and to select better waypoints. Also I would like to modify when waypoints are sequenced. I could create more useable motorcycle routes if I could get the GPS to sequence to the next waypoint in my trip/route an 1/8 to 1/4 mile prior to the current waypoint I am approaching. I would have more time to anticipate and react to what is coming up next.

Thank you!

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Via waypoint position

Jim1223 wrote:

...I have noticed that many times my intermediate enroute waypoints are not captured and my GPS is trying to re-route me back to a missed point that I have just passed...

...Does anyone know if the faster your actual speed, the wider the "waypoint capture net?"...

The speed does not affect whether the via waypoint will be reached or whether the "capture net" is wider or narrower.

In my opinion, along-the-road, you must come within 98 feet of the waypoint at a right angle to the right or left for the GPS to decide that it has actually reached that point. If the waypoint locations have been poorly selected, far away from the side of the road, there will be a problem.

It is true that if the via waypoint is not reached, the GPS will be constantly trying to go back and reach the waypoint which is now behind you. Then you must recognize what has happened and manually change the setting to go to the next waypoint up ahead.

When the route is designed in BaseCamp and transferred to the GPS, it is more likely the waypoints will be in the wrong position on the map inside the GPS.

In looking at this post and the comments of other posters I am not sure whether there is a software bug at work in transferring waypoints from BaseCamp to the GPS.

dobs108 smile

When I add a waypoint to the

When I add a waypoint to the route on the fly, I just then go to the Plan Trip app and choose the route, then touch the flag for the waypoint and will be offered to change it to a shaping point instead of a waypoint.

There was a whole discussion of this a while back. As a matter fact, it was a year ago this month. See if there is help here. http://www.poi-factory.com/node/45037

--
Frank DriveSmart55 37.322760, -79.511267

shaping point

I have had the same difficulty whether it was a via waypoint or a shaping point. If you miss the point it wants to go back.

Notwithstanding what jgermann's FAQ says, the same thing has happened to my shaping points.

jgermann wrote:

Shaping Points Advantages:
1- You will not be alerted as you're navigating and arriving at a shaping point as you are when using waypoints/vias.

2- If you deviate purposely off your route, the unit will skip the upcoming shaping point and navigate you to your next shaping or waypoint...

Some months prior to jgermann's writing his FAQ, I was editing my old FAQ on routes and trips to take into account the behavior of the newer Garmin GPSs with regard to via points and shaping points. I knew what I wanted to write - the same thing jgermann says!

But in testing my nuvi 3597 on multiple trips around my area, I could not prove it so! All routes (trips) were designed onboard the nuvi Trip Planner with via points to see how they acted, and then changed them to shaping points like phranc says above. But the shaping points were just as troublesome! I was pulling my hair out and never finished the FAQ.

It was so troubling that on a very long trip I left the 3597 home and took the 760 instead - it does not have this problem. Since then, the firmware has been updated in the 3597 several times and for all I know it may act properly today.

dobs108 smile

that's a known problem

It's a known problem to some of us regarding the way BaseCamp doesn't seem to transfer all the waypoints and if you miss one, the GPS tries to route you back from wherever you are.

There are two workarounds to these sticking points. First off, don't make all your waypoints so they don't alert. As you state you are building routes you want to use for motorcycles, I have to assume these are either rallies or tours. The first trick is to build your route in BaseCamp with all the needed points. You can use Trip Planner for this, but you will delete the route just entered and redo it from the beginning to the first point, then add the second and so on until you have rebuilt the route. Take some time after you get one or two points and after every other added point or so tell BaseCamp to display the route on the map so you can see which roads and if any points need to be moved. Now you can go back and mark the ones that keep the route on the correct road but leave some intermediate points in your route that serve as checkpoints. That way you can tell the unit to route you to the next listed point if you miss one.

Another "trick" would be to rename some points such as "Left on Rt 23." This would pop up on the banner line as soon as you went past the last alerted point. Put this waypoint on the approach to the turn with a non-alerting one after the turn so the route bends correctly.

Yes, it's a lot of computer time, but as you become used to the steps, it will go much faster. As an example. we are planning a trip next spring from coast-to-coast and I want to travel specific roads. I use listed points as the intersections of the different Interstates we will use with non-alerting points to keep me on the route between them.

Building the routes a segment at a time is a little tedious, but it also allows me to eliminate some shaping points that become unneeded because of the following point(s).

--
Illiterate? Write for free help.

Thanks for the info! There

Thanks for the info! There is plenty to learn!

Shaping Points

Thanks for the intro to shaping points. This appears to be exactly what I need to make the routes I wanted.

I pulled up several of my saved trips in basecamp and converted several via points to shaping points. I saw no difference in the trip I sent to my GPS, though. I also didn't get an option to convert to a shaping point when tapping on waypoint flags on my GPS either.

I have a Nuvi 2595. One of the links you sent me said a Nuvi 2509 series could handle shaping points, so hoped my 2595 was part of that series.

My Nuvi 2595 does have a trip planner app and gives me ability to create, manipulate, and save multiple trips, but it does not appear to have the capability I need for shaping points.

Thanks for your information.

Unlikely ...

The 2595 is an earlier device that used the initial style of trip planner. I don't believe it has been changed. Nuvis from 2013 onwards use a different system.

Yours handles your trips a segment at a time, leading to some of the issues you describe. Newer models treat trips much more like the much older nuvis that used route planner, and so show the whole trip at once so its far easier to determine where you need to go at viapoints. Your model also is not able to use shaping points, which is why you're seeing no difference since shaping points sent by BaseCamp are simply converted to via points.

--
Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Shaping points and Waypoints on 3597

From Garmin FAQ:

"If a shaping point needs to be skipped during navigation, there are two ways to do so. The first is to ignore the device temporarily until you merge back onto your custom route. If your device recognizes that you are in a position that is further along in your custom route, it will automatically skip any shaping points which you have passed, and will continue navigating to your upcoming waypoints or shaping points."

https://support.garmin.com/faqSearch/faq/textsearch & then I entered shaping points

To Skip a Waypoint Felix Krull had found the trick

http://www.poi-factory.com/node/45585?page=0#comment-416462

Perhaps with older models and or firmware the above doesn't work but when I tried it back then when we were discussing the above it had worked as described on my 3597. It should be noted that I do not use BaseCamp and create all my routes on the Trip Planner app of my unit.

On my older 255WT when I skip a Waypoint it tries twice to route me back and then understands that I don't wan't to go there any longer and continues routing me to me next Waypoint.

Some testing using BaseCamp followed by the trip planner app of the unit with various Nuvi series would be interesting to see how each series actually handles Waypoints/shaping points.

--
Nüvi 255WT with nüMaps Lifetime North America born on 602117815 / Nüvi 3597LMTHD born on 805972514 / I love Friday’s except when I’m on holidays ~ canuk

2595 - no shaping points

According to canuk's support link, the 2595 does not support shaping points. The 3597 does.

The comments from Garmin Support seem to indicate that a shaping point, if missed on the route/trip, still has to be addressed manually unless you drive ahead for some distance. I must assume that the GPS in that time will be telling us to go back to the missed shaping point.

dobs108 smile

I use HD Ride Planner

I have never used basecamp but I have used the HD Ride Planner on line to do what you are trying to do. I drag the waypoint to the middle of the road just before the point I want to see.

I export it from the Ride Planner and import it into my HD GPS and have never had a problem using it.

The Ride planner will save all your routes but it does not import a rout with waypoints. All saved routes are also available on your phone or table using the app.

--
d

Well ...

dobs108 wrote:

The comments from Garmin Support seem to indicate that a shaping point, if missed on the route/trip, still has to be addressed manually unless you drive ahead for some distance. I must assume that the GPS in that time will be telling us to go back to the missed shaping point.

If you miss a shaping point you will be directed to it unless/until you hit a point on the route past the shaping point. Again this only applies to nuvis from the 2013 year onwards that use the newer version of trip planner.

--
Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

"Do not alert" in BaseCamp

Using "Do not alert" in BaseCamp after the route is complete is the way to go. They do not expect you to stop and do not redirect you to go back.

--
Mary, Nuvi 2450, Garmin Viago, Honda Navigation, Nuvi 750 (gave to son)

waypoints

Only sure way to program way points is to make sure the way point is in the lane you plan to travel in.

I blow up the view in the GPS of the location to place the waypoint then make sure it will actually be within 20 ft or less from my drive by.

In most cases on a return trip I have to reprogram the waypoint to the other side of the highway or it will demand I turn around.

I always place waypoints several hundred yards past where I plan to turn or exit. This way the GPS will warn you to take the turn or exit beforehand and give you time to enter the next waypoint. I usually give the waypoints names that agree with the location.

--
garry

Shaping Points

I use my Trip Planner app just twice a year when I go to Florida on holidays.

I'm not 100% certain but quite confident that if you miss a shaping point on your route the unit will not try and redirect you to the shaping point as it does with a WayPoint.

In the Garmin FAQ they also state "This will only occur with shaping points. Your device will not automatically skip waypoints in your custom route unless you navigate to them."

I have all the Welcome centers for each state in my Trip Planner and if I leave them as WayPoints it's a pain as it'll try and get you off the interstate to try and make you absolutely go through the waypoint that you decided you didn't wan't to go.

If you place the Welcome Center as a shaping point you must be attentive because you can drive right past it as the GPS won't tell you your approaching it but on a positive note it won't try and route you back through it if you ignore that shaping point.

I'll test this out once again when I head back in mid October and report back but firmly believe that if you miss a shaping point the unit (3597 in my case) will ignore it and continue routing you to the next shaping or WayPoint in your route.

https://forums.garmin.com/archive/index.php/t-94869.html

See near bottom of the page with TRIAL T1: T2 T3 and T4

http://www.gpscity.ca/questions?qid=36767

See reply # 4

--
Nüvi 255WT with nüMaps Lifetime North America born on 602117815 / Nüvi 3597LMTHD born on 805972514 / I love Friday’s except when I’m on holidays ~ canuk