Florida quietly shortened yellow light standards & lengths, resulting in more red light camera tickets

 

TAMPA BAY, Florida -- A subtle, but significant tweak to Florida's rules regarding traffic signals has allowed local cities and counties to shorten yellow light intervals, resulting in millions of dollars in additional red light camera fines.

The 10 News Investigators discovered the Florida Department of Transportation (FDOT) quietly changed the state's policy on yellow intervals in 2011, reducing the minimum below federal recommendations. The rule change was followed by engineers, both from FDOT and local municipalities, collaborating to shorten the length of yellow lights at key intersections, specifically those with red light cameras (RLCs).

While yellow light times were reduced by mere fractions of a second, research indicates a half-second reduction in the interval can double the number of RLC citations -- and the revenue they create. The 10 News investigation stemmed from a December discovery of a dangerously short yellow light in Hernando County. After the story aired, the county promised to re-time all of its intersections, and the 10 News Investigators promised to dig into yellow light timing all across Tampa Bay.

Full Article:
http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=316418

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Clive RLCs

rvrrat wrote:

Right here in central Iowa. Clive shortened the yellow lights. Probably for safety though. I know this because they said they are not out for the money.

Couldn't find any reference to what you said. I did find a 2009 study on RL running in Clive.
By far the greatest offence was left turns on the red, or not coming to a stop before turning right. These offences outnumbered straight through runners by about a factor of 10.
Yellow light timing would have a limited effect in these instances.

--
nuvi 855. Life is not fair. I don't care who told you it is.

No, it's not ALL about the money

I disagree that "it's all about the money". Sure, that's why the towns are doing it, and that's what everyone is thinking about when they get screwed for getting caught because of a shorter yellow, but LET'S NOT FORGET about

- the ticket you receive for running the light
- your driving record taking a ding!
- your insurance rates going up

As a professional driver trying to protect my CDL if I were to get caught going through one of these traps, even in a personal vehicle, it will go against my Commercial Drivers License. I will receive "CSA Points" and this will affect my being hired by another company or fired by my current one.

But what's worse? The potential new commercial drivers out there. Say you're 21 and thinking about becoming a professional driver. You get caught in one of these traps. It only takes ONE TICKET for a trucking company to say no to you when you come looking for a job with them.

As far as I'm concerned, the powers that be that instituted this policy SHOULD ALL BE LOCKED UP!

--
Amazing GPS: I once was lost but now am found.

Florida throws it in reverse...

In a stroke of conscience or in the wake of bad publicity, they will lengthen yellow light standards by 0.4 seconds... sometime later this year.
/true story

http://origin.wtsp.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=319733

I'm sure the refund checks to all convicted under the corrupt rule will be in the mail shortly thereafter.
/sarcasm

--
JMoo On

short yellow lights

For all that claim the Red Light Cameras are for safety, this article is quite telling. It says everything I have been thinking all along.

--
Dudlee

Same here

pb46 wrote:
spokybob wrote:

As long as JM keeps posting the locations, I won't ever have a problem.

I agree ...Very usefull! Thanks JM.

I agree.

--
Retired Street Pilot C550, Garmin Drive 50 USA+CAN LMT 5, I phone 12 pro.

DOT allowed this

jgermann wrote:
gatorj wrote:

needs to address this issue. For safety reasons there should be standards on at least the state, if not federal, level to prevent municipalities from doing this.

Wasn't it FDOT that set the new minimum standards in 2011 for all cities in the state?

In 2011 the Florida DOT passed a rule allowing cities to shorten the yellow light duration below Federal standards. The legislature needs to pass a law to effectively over turn this.

Not quite right

gatorj wrote:
jgermann wrote:
gatorj wrote:

needs to address this issue. For safety reasons there should be standards on at least the state, if not federal, level to prevent municipalities from doing this.

Wasn't it FDOT that set the new minimum standards in 2011 for all cities in the state?

In 2011 the Florida DOT passed a rule allowing cities to shorten the yellow light duration below Federal standards. The legislature needs to pass a law to effectively over turn this.

Often, in news reports on this subject, the term "federal standards" has been used when "federal guidelines" woud have been the proper term. In fact, the National Motorist Association has written a letter pleading with the feds to set standards, but that has not yet happened to my knowledge.

I realize this is nit-picking but words do make a difference. If there were federal standards and FDOT had gone below them, then that would perhaps be illegal.

The root of the discussion has to do with a federal recommendation that municipalities use the 85th percentile speed when employing the formula to determine yellow light timing. FDOT at one time had the 85th percentile language in its regulations because, at the time they were written, there was a proposal in the legislature to incorporate it. However, that bill died and FDOT adjusted its wording.

potato potahto

jgermann wrote:

Often, in news reports on this subject, the term "federal standards" has been used when "federal guidelines" woud have been the proper term. In fact, the National Motorist Association has written a letter pleading with the feds to set standards, but that has not yet happened to my knowledge.

I realize this is nit-picking but words do make a difference. If there were federal standards and FDOT had gone below them, then that would perhaps be illegal.

The root of the discussion has to do with a federal recommendation that municipalities use the 85th percentile speed when employing the formula to determine yellow light timing. FDOT at one time had the 85th percentile language in its regulations because, at the time they were written, there was a proposal in the legislature to incorporate it. However, that bill died and FDOT adjusted its wording.

However it's worded, when municipalities, towns, cities, go lower than the guidelines, that is the issue, not how it's described.

Someone needs a good suing

Hopefully no one was hurt because of this. If they were, though, maybe getting hit with a multi-million dollar verdict will send a message to Florida's powers-that-be.

Wondering

scott_dog wrote:

Hopefully no one was hurt because of this. If they were, though, maybe getting hit with a multi-million dollar verdict will send a message to Florida's powers-that-be.

I'm wondering if "powers-that-be" could be sued for not enforcing, say, speed laws if someone was hurt as a result of someone else speeding.

perhaps if they made a change

jgermann wrote:
scott_dog wrote:

Hopefully no one was hurt because of this. If they were, though, maybe getting hit with a multi-million dollar verdict will send a message to Florida's powers-that-be.

I'm wondering if "powers-that-be" could be sued for not enforcing, say, speed laws if someone was hurt as a result of someone else speeding.

It's because of the potentially unsafe change they made. It'd be like Florida changing the speed limits to 150mph, and then someone dies in a high-yet-legal speed accident. The state may or may not have liability for making a change that put lives in danger.

how about ...

-Nomad- wrote:
jgermann wrote:
scott_dog wrote:

Hopefully no one was hurt because of this. If they were, though, maybe getting hit with a multi-million dollar verdict will send a message to Florida's powers-that-be.

I'm wondering if "powers-that-be" could be sued for not enforcing, say, speed laws if someone was hurt as a result of someone else speeding.

It's because of the potentially unsafe change they made. It'd be like Florida changing the speed limits to 150mph, and then someone dies in a high-yet-legal speed accident. The state may or may not have liability for making a change that put lives in danger.

How about when the state shortens yellow lights for the sole purpose of making more money, knowing that short yellows=more accidents?

FDOT to give motorists more time to stop for red lights

On May 31, the Florida Department of Transportation announced it was re-calculating yellow-light durations assuming drivers had a slower reaction time, giving about an extra four-tenths of a second before yellow lights turned red. All intersections with red-light cameras will be recalculated by the end of the year. Every other intersection in Florida will be recalculated by June 30, 2015.

--
Jerry...Jacksonville,Fl Nüvi1450,Nuvi650,Nuvi 2495 and Mapsource.

Entering

Quote:

Around here, you have not run the red light unless you enter the intersection on red. If you enter on yellow, it does not matter if the light turns red before you clear the intersection. Running a red light requires you to run the red light, not a yellow light.

I believe that's the law here in British Columbia as well. The camera takes two pictures, one is when you enter the intersection and it's supposed to show the light state as well.

it figures

it figures

$$$ is of the essence,

$$$ is of the essence, safety is of no concern.

lol

4 y.o. kids can stay onside in soccer and ice hockey. A prudent motorist can handle yellow lights, and red lights. They are generally 1 sec per 10 mph of speed limit.

Not to mention that rlcs arm a fraction of a sec after red.

Honestly imho smartphones really changed things for society, meaning there's one side now to every story, not two.

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