CUSTOM POI (all I see is a dot)

That must be it.

(Given all the things Gary has done for the world during his career, I think he deserves it.)

Thanks ever so much for all that work. It sounds like I'll stick with 14.0.1 for the foreseeable future.

Someone suggested that 14.3.1 might work. If I try that today, I'll report back.

Regarding 32 vs 64-bit and Win7 vs XP, remember that charlesd45 is using XP and 14.3.2 failed--I don't think he told us if it's the 32 or 64.

It definitely sounds now like Gary is the exception to the rule in his ability to have 14.3.2 give audio alerts. Does anyone remember reading of anyone else saying that 14.3.2 works? I think someone said that BoxCar was successful with 14.3.1.

You are welcome.

PoiLoader 2.6.1/SoX 14.3.2 worked on several 32 bit XP computers that I tried it on, and works on my 32 bit Vista Home Premium laptop . I also used SoX 14.3.1 ok on my own 32 bit XP Desktop computer. That is all result in working audio alerts.

However Gary does seem to be the exception to the rule as far as 64 bit computers is concerned.

Well, after the 14.3.2 fiasco, I thought I'd try using sox 14.3.1 and its three .dll files in place of the old tried and true 14.0.1 that works for everyone, including us 64-bit Windows Operating Systems.

14.3.1 fails to work with POILoader 2.6.1 as badly as 14.3.2 did--but in a very unusual way.

When loading my standard POI files (csv, bmp, wav) with sox.exe and its three dll files (all 14.3.1), all load without an error message.

But in simulating a route past or to my various POI locations, I do get an audio alert. And here's where it gets spooky odd. The audio alert for all POIs is my Speed-Camera audio wav file! So when passing a school zone (expecting my school zone audio) or passing an Interstate Rest Area (expecting my Rest Area audio), I receive a Speed Camera audio alert.

Maybe someone with programming experience and knowledge of how POILoader ands sox work can figure out what's going on in terms of getting future POILoaders and future sox.exes to work and give nuvis audio alerts.

But for now, my results for 64-bit Windows systems are that with wav files, the old tried and true sox.exe 14.0.1 (no dlls needed) will work as we want it to with POILoader 2.6.1; sox.exe version 14.3.1 with dll files for me gives an audio alert, but a wrong one(!); and finally, as reported by others too, sox.exe version 14.3.2 with its associated dll files gives no audio alerts on nuvis. All three versions of sox with POILoader 2.6.1 load POI files with no error messages but only one actually works for the majority of us with a 64-bit Windows PC.

32 bit

Running Windows 7

- I remove all custom POIs from my zumo
- made a 1 line .csv to a location nearby
- ran POILoader 2.6.1 w/sox 14.3.2
- loaded it into internal memory

The test gave an alert but with the wrong wav file. It used a wav file from the speed camera file that was located 21 sub-folders away ??? I am truely confused now. Tried to figure this one out with no luck after multiple trys.

Changed the sox back to the original sox file I got from this site, recompiled the POI and loaded it into internal mem. Everything exactly as I did with the newer sox.

The test now played the proper Test wav file that was in the same folder as the test.csv file.

So starting from the beginning and doing a true test showed that something is amiss. What, I haven't got a clue at this point.

Using the newer sox the gpi file size ended up being 505 KB. Changing to the older sox and recompiling the gpi file size was now 80 KB and wirked properly.

I actually expected no alert sound but was totally surprised to get the wav sound from another folder with a completely different name.

Any one have any clue? I too like to keep up with current versions but it looks like this one is gonna take a little bit of figuring before I'll be using it on a regular basis.

Since my 3790lmt has VA, I'll just ask it to beam me where I want to go. Lot easeir than going thru all these steps.

bear, Is your Windows 7 the 32-bit or 64-bit version?

Interesting that you confirm my wrong audio alert error with the new sox. It's interesting, too, that for each of us, the audio that plays is the Speed Camera audio.

Others have suggested that the newer sox doesn't play well with 64-bit Windows versions, yet charles has the problem with his 32-bit Windows XP.

It really is becoming more of a question of how gary and a small number of others have the new sox working rather than the question of why many of us can't get it to work and have to keep the old standalone file of v14.0.1 sox.

I just now tried my one-line csv and my test wav file using POILoader 2.6.1 and SoX 14.0.1, 14.3.1 and 14.3.2 on a Vista 32 bit Windows Home Premium computer and all three resulted in .gpi files of exactly the same size (301 KB).

I hate to say this, and mean no offence, but It sounds to me like you accidently pointed POILoader to the wrong folder when you did the 14.3.2 run.

BTW is your Windows 7 64 bit?

I had the same problem. Reran POILoader and the problem fixed itself.

My Windows 7 is 64 bit.

I ran POILoader in Manual mode to set the 1/4 mile alert with both sox versions.

Newer sox.exe
I put the sox.exe and 3 dll files in the POILoader folder for the first batch of tests that all gave the same result playing the speed camera file sound wav from 21 folders away. It had a file size of 505 KB.

Why and how since the speed camera sound wav has a completely different name and isn't any where near the folder I was compiling. I have a POI make folder with about 40 different sub-folders, one being my test folder with nothing else but my 3 test files, csv bmp and wav. It is called Cranberry (the township where the single POI is located).

Older sox.exe
I removed the sox.exe and 3 dll files from the POILoader folder. I placed the older sox.exe back into the POILoader folder. I then recompiled the file with the exact same manual mode steps and settings and had a successful outcome with a file size of 80 KB.

@Evert,
No offense taken. Had I pointed POILoader to the wrong folder I would not of had the same name gpi file and I wouldn't of ever had an alert when simulating the route since that was the only custom POI on the GPS during the test and I don't have any other custom POIs on my PC at that location.

I have had a redlight camera alert when out of state before but I have never had a speed alert on my GPS since there are no locally.

What is even stranger is that CraigW had the same strange result with the speed camera wav from a different folder playing. At the very least, if I'm going crazy so is CraigW!

I see that Box Car said he reran POILoader and it fixed itself. I reran it multiple times with the same incorrect result.

I was just looking at the compiled POI file list. I compile my files to a folder on my PC and copy whats wanted on the different GPSs. I have some files stored individualy in folders and have others grouped in 40+ folders.

I just looked at the gpi file list and realized that the last files I compiled before this testing today were the redlight and speed camera files last Wednesday. So it appears that when I use the newer sox it is using the last good wav file that POILoader used from last Wednesday and when I use the older sox it uses the actual wav file from the pointed to folder.

I think I'm now 1 step closer to PC mass confusion.

@bear007 and CraigW

You guys have me really scratching my head.

It is odd that it is with the camera wav file for both of you.

Since there are no such cameras any where near where I live, I don't have any of those files on my computers. So maybe that is why I am get getting the same odd results you are.??????

@Evert,

On the 64 bit system I am guessing that if the last POI file compiled had no wav you may not get a wav and if the last POI file compiled had a different wav that is what is sounding during the alert.

I just thinking ...
So if you run your test POI with the old sox first and then run the test with the new sox you might get good results, a false positive.

So maybe SoX 4.3.2 does not like your test wav file? Can you think of any reason it would not think it is good? What are the specs on the wav file?

I just did a test using the old sox first, all is correct. Then did the new sox and it was the correct file same file size this time

but

with the new sox still in the POILoader folder I re did the redlight and speed camer files and they both now have the test wav sound as their alert sound.

It appears that with the new sox in the POILoader folder with our 64 bit systems that the last wav (or no sound wav) used will be used with the old sox for all subsequent files compiled using the new sox.

Ouch!

I must confess that when the pros are confused with an issue, I feel better about my confusion

Keep up the good work.

Just a thought--it's been "common knowledge" until very recently that sox 14.0.1 works with POILoader and Garmin nuvis and that versions other than 14.0.1 do not work. Wouldn't it be easiest simply to confirm this consensus and not suggest that newer versions of sox are to be used for now?

Sorry but your wording is confusing me. Did you mean this?:

It appears that with the new sox in the POILoader folder with our 64 bit systems that the last wav (or no sound wav) used with the old sox will be used for all subsequent files compiled using the new sox.

I agree. I'm guessing my older version is 14.0.1 since I got it from a link on this site 7 or 8 months ago.

I can't see suggesting using the newer version until we figure this out. Now that we know what wav file it is pointing to we need to figure out why? Also, is it only on Win 7 64 bit systems?

I would say that tomorrow's another day but I'll be busy tomorrow. I'm volunteering at PGH airport to haul luggage and assist the Wheel Chair Veterans flyng into Pittsburgh for the National Veteran's Wheel Chair games all next week.

As I mentioned before I think Sox prematurely shuts down when it cannot access its dll files on a 64 bit machine.

So maybe it is POILoader that decides to use the last succesful wav file. And if there were no last successful wav files it just creates a custom poi with no sound alert.

Thank you very much for doing that. I know a lot of veterans that have been helped by kind folks like yourself and they all tell me how grateful they were for the assistance received.

I think your right on.

POILoader loads the pointed to file, loads the pointed to bmp located in the same folder, then it starts to load sox which quietly fails, but it knows it was loading a wav so it loads the last file it remembers loading.

Or

The new sox with Win 7 64 bit is still active but has a pointing to problem in its programming running in Win 7 64 bit so it just points to the last loaded file.

BTW, I just put the old sox back to re-compile my files and all file sizes are back to their original good sizes.

I don’t think that would happen. I have run SoX in command line mode and if I do not give it the correct path to the input file, it issues a complaint and shuts down. If I run it in command mode and use the silent switch it just shuts down when an error is encountered.

Most likely POILoader calls SoX with the silent switch included in the command line.

I would bet that if you ran SoX 14.3.2 in command line mode on your computer and just did a simple wav to wav conversion, it would work with no problem.

That is because it would have no problem following the path to the wav file and apparently the simple conversion requires no dll files.

I think the wav has everything sox needs inside the file.

What does POILoader send to sox when it calls it?

What output is POILoader wanting?

I believe you said something like this earlier -- and right now, that seems to be the wisest pathway until the 'avaunt guarde experimenters' finally reach their 'Ah Ha' moment.

As some others have reported success, some reported partial success, while most here have reported failures, I don't feel comfortable in sending my Garmin Tricks & Tips readers, many of whom are new to the GPS world, along a path that will lead them to frustration -- so I retracted my suggestion in the article in making the change to the newest sox.exe (v. 14.3.2) w/associated .dll files, in favor of returning (or using for the first time) to v. 14.0.1. My other older articles which recommended 14.0.1 can stand as previously presented.

I, of course, have to mirror that maneuver, as I will be using my unit for future testing of all the articles I write and must be on the same page as my readers -- wherever possible.

I would love to use the latest that is available for processing Extras/Custom POIs, including the current POI Loader 2.6.1 (which I use) and the latest sox.exe, but the new version of sox.exe has created such a conundrum that returning to the tried and proven 14.0.1 is "NOW's" best approach.

I'll be waiting, of course, to hear the 'Ah Ha'.

Gary Hayman

sox is failing when attempting to open the libgomp-1.dll file.

I put my wav in the C:\program files (x86)\Garmin\ folder and ran the following command line.

c:\Program Files (x86)\Garmin>sox cranberry.wav cranberry.mp3

... it returned ...

sox FAIL util: Unable to load LAME encoder library (libmp3lame).
sox FAIL formats: can't open output file `cranberry.mp3':

It is not what sox needs, it is what changes to the sound file that Garmin wants to make.

Basically sox always takes an input sound file and converts it to an output sound file that has different specifications.

The simplest command line would be:
sox inputfilename outputfilename

Example:
sox test.wav test2.wav

would simply copy a wav file to another file with a new name without making any changes.

There are a lot of complex switches that can be added to the command line that instruct sox about the specifications of the input file and the desired changes to be in the output file.

The output file can be just a change in the specifications of wav files, or the output can be an entirely different type of sound file from a long list of choices.

I have no idea of exactly what form of output POILoader calls for in the command line but it must need some kind of changes or it would not need to use SoX.

It is included in the instructions that the libmp3lame dll file is needed to do mp3 conversion and they could not include it in the package due to ownership problems. There are instuctions on how to get the file but it is not needed for the task we have been trying to do.

Just try sox cranberry.wav cranberry2.wav

Remember the goal of the experiment was to show that SoX would have no problem following the path to the wav file.

Thanks. Your website is a great place to go for tips and tricks and it'll be where I go to look for a new sox when all is figured out in the future.

Let's hope for an aha soon. I do like to use the latest versions of many things and tend to be a guinea pig for several updates. For the most part they work and I'm pleased with my decisions. But there have been those times when I really wish I had let others go first so they could warn me that "Here be Monsters"

It almost (let me stress almost) makes me want to try the new sox with an older pre 2.6.1 POILoader and see what happens.

sox cranberry.wav cranberry2.wav works. I even put the -V2 infront of the input file and increased the vol.

So if sox 14.3.2 works this far we need to figure out what POILoader is asking it to do to confirm that next step.

Heading for bed. Duties call in the AM.

Since there was no AHA moment, I better put sox 14.0.1 back for now so I don't forget later.

Good luck to all those confused so far.

Me too. I am hearing echos in the back of my head that say "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread.

Also "Why oh why did I ever leave Wyoming"

My head is just saying ouch!

I'm done for tonight!

I have found the location and name of the sox output file used when POILoader calls up sox.exe.

On my friend’s 64 bit Vista machine the path is:
C:\users\AppData\Local\Temp\POILoader\temp.wav

Probably that path would be used on all 32 and 64 bit Vista and 7 machines.

On my 32 bit XP machine the path is:
C:\Documents and Settings\Clint\Local Settings\Temp\POILoader\temp.wav

That (plus other experience described in my previous posts) tells me:

-POILoader is using sox.exe to make sure that the wav file(s) it uses conform to Garmin wav specs (since input and output files are wav).

-If there are multiple wav files involved in a POILoader session, sox.exe is called several times and the sox output overwrites the temp.wav file each time. So at the end of a PoiLoader session, the temp.wav file content will be that of the last wav file processed.

-If POILoader has ever used sox.exe 14.0.1 on a machine the temp.wav will exist. If PoiLoader then uses sox.14.3.2 on that machine, and the machine does not like the sox dll files, sox silently fails and does not change temp.wav. If a single wav file was being processed, the sound alert will have the content of the temp.wav file previously created by sox 14.0.1. If multiple wav files are involved in that POILoader session, all the sound alerts will have the same content as that temp.wav file.

If POILoader has never used sox.exe 14.0.1 on a machine and the machine is not friendly with sox 14.3.2, then the result of using POILoader and sox.exe 14.3.2 on that machine will be no sound alert at all (since there will be no temp.wav file available.

So the next step is for some one that has a machine with the 14.3.2 problem to run sox in command line mode using all four wav output file formats (sample rate, sample size, data encoding, and channels). (The input format does not need to be specified beause the information is in the file header.) Here are the properties of a temp.wav file created by POILoader 2.6.1 via sox.exe 14.3.2:

Bitrate 705 kbps
Audio Sample size 16 bit
Channels (1)
Audio Sample rate 44 kHz
Audio Format PCM

That will tell us what error sox reports and maybe give us a lead towards a fix.

I can do it Monday at the Senior Center (I don’t have a 64bit Windows 7 at home.)

BTW I doubt that using a prior version of POILoader would make any difference and suggest that we stick with 2.6.1 in these tests.

I think you're asking us to do something like this:

C:\sox-14-3-2>sox TourGuide_Schools.wav -c1 -r705 test.wav

using some of these output options where the first wav file is an audio file I use for my POIs now:

FORMAT OPTIONS (fopts):
-v|--volume FACTOR Input file volume adjustment factor (real number)
--ignore-length Ignore input file length given in header; read to
-t|--type FILETYPE File type of audio
-s/-u/-f/-U/-A/-i/-a/-g Encoding type=signed-integer/unsigned-integer/floa
point/mu-law/a-law/ima-adpcm/ms-adpcm/gsm-full-rat
-e|--encoding ENCODING Set encoding (ENCODING in above list)
-b|--bits BITS Encoded sample size in bits
-1/-2/-3/-4/-8 Encoded sample size in bytes
-N|--reverse-nibbles Encoded nibble-order
-X|--reverse-bits Encoded bit-order
--endian little|big|swap Encoded byte-order; swap means opposite to default
-L/-B/-x Short options for the above
-c|--channels CHANNELS Number of channels of audio data; e.g. 2 = stereo
-r|--rate RATE Sample rate of audio
-C|--compression FACTOR Compression factor for output format
--add-comment TEXT Append output file comment
--comment TEXT Specify comment text for the output file
--comment-file FILENAME File containing comment text for the output file
--no-glob Don't `glob' wildcard match the following filename

Am I right? If so, what should the line look like before I run sox?

When I run:

C:\sox-14-3-2>sox TourGuide_Schools.wav -c1 -r705 test.wav

the test.wav is created with no error, but is a garbled version of my input wav file so I need more format options, I think. But--a file named test.wav is created and does play and no error messages result. All files (sox, the dlls and the input wav file) are all kept and run from my sox-14-3-2 directory--and it's where the outputted test.wav is created.

Try this:
C:\sox-14-3-2\sox TourGuide_Schools.wav -e signed-integer -r 44k -c 1 -b 16 test.wav

Notes:
The signed-integer is one of the PCM choices and there is no way to tell which PCM style POILoader uses in its call to sox.exe

There is a space after each –x item e.g. –r{space}44k

Oh boy, this may not help if you're looking for an error message. The command (both with the added spaces after each -x and without the added spaces) creates a beautiful test.wav file that sounds identical to the original--and no error message is created.

And for what it's worth, all the sox files as well as the input and created output wav files were/are in the same directory for the test in case the problem is due to things being in different directories in real "nuvi POILoader" life. And obviously, this test did not involve POILoader calling on sox.

The one difference I see is that the original wav file I used is 49k in size while the test.wav created is 133k.

PS--you did want me to type "signed-integer" and not choose a numeral, right?

Right, that is the correct way to type it.

Your test helped in that you proved that sox 4.3.2 works ok on your 64 bit Windows 7, at least to do a direct wav file conversion without POILoader in the loop, and caused me to go back and check elsewhere.

Along with your test result and now knowing about the temp.wav file, I went back to my XP and 32 bit Vista computers and deleted the temp.wav file on them.

After the temp.wav file was deleted I found it was not created again by running POILoader 2.6.1 using sox 14.3.1 and then 14.3.2

So all this time I thought my one and only sound alert was working with the latest version of sox, was a big mistake.

The sound alert was working on all of them because I had started out with SoX 14.0.1 on them and the orignial temp.wav file was there to be used by POILoader even if the newer sox calls were not effective. Sure is sneaky for neither POILoader or SoX to give any indication that all did not go well.

I don’t know why they won’t work and intend to look further into it and see if I can find out what causes them to flop.

Now all those that have crows for me to eat – I am heating up the oven, so throw them over the fence.

I tried sending sox 14.0.1 the command line CraigW used for his test and found that the reason that sox 14.3.2 does not work with POILoader is the difference in command line syntax.

Here is the command line syntax to do CraigW’s test for the two versions:

C:\sox-14-3-2\sox TourGuide_Schools.wav -e signed-integer -r 44k -c 1 -b 16 test.wav

C:\sox-14-0-1\sox TourGuide_Schools.wav -s -r 44000 -c 1 -2 test.wav

Notice that:
“-e signed-integer” was “-s” in the old version

The old version sample rate is in Hertz compared to kHz in the new version

The old version Audio sample size is in bytes “-2” compared to bits “-b16” in the new version.

I tried both ways and find that neither version will accept the other version's syntax.

So until POILoader tests sox.exe for version and adjusts the syntax of the command it sends to sox, “Go with the Leader” is more like “Stick with me in the mud”.

Your "Aha Moment" is well appreciated. I personally think the next step would be to write up the results of your work on this and submit it to Garmin as an enhancement request. Their recent update of POILoader shows interest in updating the utilities, this would be a "no-brainer" type of enhancement that may be fairly easy and quick to implement.

But that's just my 1.37 cents (adjusted for inflation) worth.

So, in English, does this mean we need a revised POILoader version from Garmin to work with the newer sox version issue and that there's nothing we can do (short of sticking with the current POILoader and the 14.0.1 sox)?

The scary part of this is that I believe Garmin has never claimed to have wav audio support for POILoader meaning that they have no obligation to fix the current problem or to build it into future versions. Bad timing, given Garmin's trend to offer fewer mp3-compatible nuvis with most new nuvi models being wav-only.

Have I summarized this correctly or does the above need to be corrected?

That is correct . It is hard to tell if it really matters without sifting through all the updates, corrections etc. to see if any would affect the fairly simple conversion that POILoader is doing. Probably not, but as BoxCar said, it would be fairly simple to add programming to POILoader that would allow it to keep up with changes to sox. And it would seem the thing to do considering that users could reasonably be expected to get the latest sox when they go to SoX exchange to get it.

I cannot figure why Garmin remains so reticent about the wav audio and the use of sox. Especially now, as you said, that Garmin seems to be going to wav-only nuvis .

There still is not much about it on their developer forms – I saw one request to add information about using wav to POILoader’s help file, but so far it has gone unanswered by any official Garmin response.

I think Garmin will continue to use their high school drop-out programmers (who apparently know nothing about even simple error checking and are too lazy or ignorant to do the easy changes BoxCar mentioned. If so, they may use sox 14.0.1 forever.

So the bottom line is to use sox 14.0.1 until Garmin changes POILoader and starts telling their customers what the heck they are doing in enough detail to use their software without all the pitfalls being encountered.

At least now we will know what to tell folks what to do about “ghost sound alerts” and why they are getting “funny alerts” from wav files several folders away.

to: Evert, Craigw and bear007

Gentlemen, this was an excellent use of the forum to understand a problem. Your collaboration was interesting to follow.

Thanks

It certainly was a learning experience for me...about like learning to run Android Gingerbread from a SD card on my B&N nook color.

After all this, what is the conclusion to this problem. What to use and what not to use. I didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest with my orginial question. Thanks for all the effort guys.

I'm NOW recommending, on my site, to use POI Loader 2.6.1 and sox.exe 14.0.1 for those with non-mp3 units.

Gary Hayman
Garmin nuvi Tricks & Tips

.

Ditto, jg, and luckily for everyone here at POI Factory, it's the one that can be found, downloaded and used, thanks to charlesd45, another of the sleuths in this thread--and to TPTB for including the sox zip file on this site for users' downloading.

http://www.poi-factory.com/node/25730

Thanks to gary as well, who I imagine also offers a link to the 14.0.1 download. I haven't checked for it there since I got it here.

How does this sound, Evert--and any Garmin folks lurking here who could have input to your company's programmers?

Given the large number of files that are already created when installing POILoader--and given that as I understand it, sox is freeware--couldn't Garmin include a sox installation with future versions of the POILoader installation? That'd guarantee that POILoader would find the correct sox (and any dlls needed) and would be able correctly to issue commands to sox that sox will understand?

This would have the added benefit that sox wouldn't need to be added by Windows users to the POILoader directory, a cause of much "why don't I get audio alerts?" issues here at The Factory and elsewhere from newbies to custom POI loading.

Even for folks using mp3 audio, the presence of sox creates no issues for them. I imagine that the Mac version of POILoader would not contain or install sox since it's not needed for them.

And since POILoader would install the "correct" sox, etc., in the POILoader directory, even folks that already have and use other versions of sox would have no problem since they'd have installed other sox version to (most likely) c:\sox-xx-x-x\ so the POILoader version of sox wouldn't overwrite or conflict with another sox independently installed. Unless the sox installation writes something to the Windows Registry (which I think it does NOT do), a PC with multiple versions of sox run from different directories wouldn't be an issue.

So Garmin, why not include a sox installation in your next Windows POILoader?

[/SoapBox Mode off]