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POI Loader deletes trucking database

 

Here's something interesting -- I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought that this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded, but in retrospect, it should be obvious, as the trucking data shows up in the directory structure as three files --

NTTS.gma
NTTS.gpi
NTTS.unl

Truthfully, the POI loader simply deletes the .gpi file, not the other two.

I guess it's a good thing I'm a packrat -- I was able to go onto my back up drive and copy the file back over the the 560.

--
KD5XB in DM84

But it was doing

KD5XB wrote:

Here's something interesting -- I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought that this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded, but in retrospect, it should be obvious, as the trucking data shows up in the directory structure as three files --

NTTS.gma
NTTS.gpi
NTTS.unl

Truthfully, the POI loader simply deletes the .gpi file, not the other two.

I guess it's a good thing I'm a packrat -- I was able to go onto my back up drive and copy the file back over the the 560.

But it as doing exactly what you had told it to do - eliminate ALL custom POI. That means it will delete any file ending in .GPI. It's one of those unintended consequences of giving a command to a computer. They don't always do what you would like them to do.

--
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy, 35th U.S. president

Wow

Wow,

Thank goodness for backups, eh?

It does seem to me that Garmin should have somehow protected the trucking database against an action like this if the database came preinstalled on a trucker's GPS only because many may fall into the same trap when using POI Loader to control their owner-installed POI files.

On the other hand, I expect Garmin's CS could restore the deleted file if a owner called with this problem.

It's an easy gotcha!

CraigW wrote:

It does seem to me that Garmin should have somehow protected the trucking database against an action like this if the database came preinstalled on a trucker's GPS only because many may fall into the same trap when using POI Loader to control their owner-installed POI files.

Which is why I posted the thread. I figured that if it trips me up, and I'm fairly computer-literate (who else on here can operate a 29? Or even knows what that might be? Or was... LOL!) -- then that info needs to be out in public so others don't lose their files.

CraigW wrote:

On the other hand, I expect Garmin's CS could restore the deleted file if a owner called with this problem.

It's a simple matter to download it again from the Garmin web site, but at 220+ MB it might take a little while!

--
KD5XB in DM84

I never delete, copy and replace

Good job on the backup! I keep 4 GPSs backed up all of the time. Needed it once.

I actually compile all my GPI files to a directory on my hard drive and just drag and drop to the different GPSs that need the update for that particular file.

As I've said in other posts, I create multiple GPIs for all of the different categories. When the SD card GARMIN\POI folder is empty you can drag and drop the different categories into the folder in the order you want them to be displayed on your GPS. After that you just drag and drop (replace) the updates and it doesn't change the order.

With this method it doesn't ever delete anything on me and I control the display. I hated having my rest stops show up way down the custom POI list.

--
Zumo 665, (2) Nuvi 765Ts & 1450LMT | 2005 Harley Road King, Black Cherry Pearl / Black Pearl

IM NOT SO LUCKY. Garmin DEZL560LT

I didnt back up my NTTS POI .. you thinks u can help me out here. I dont want to pay $29.99 to download another NTTS from garmin. thanks

Backup..

That's why I backup almost everything I download.. no matter what it is. smile

Nuvi1300WTGPS

--
I'm not really lost.... just temporarily misplaced!

Dezl560lt

yeah I been try to install custom poi. finally figure it out. then i accidently delete NTTS.gpi from the Garmin Unit folder. Im try to do files recover.. cross my figer...lol

How?

southeastdriver wrote:

yeah I been try to install custom poi. finally figure it out. then i accidently delete NTTS.gpi from the Garmin Unit folder. Im try to do files recover.. cross my figer...lol

I know of a couple of ways to delete a .gpi file from a nuvi.
1. while nuvi attached to computer, go into Garmin/POI folder and delete a .gpi file(s)
2. let POI Loader delete all custom POIs.

How did you wind up deleting the file?

Rather than try to recover the file, are you able to do a new run of POI Loader to restore it?

DOES IT MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE?

jgermann wrote:
southeastdriver wrote:

yeah I been try to install custom poi. finally figure it out. then i accidently delete NTTS.gpi from the Garmin Unit folder. Im try to do files recover.. cross my figer...lol

I know of a couple of ways to delete a .gpi file from a nuvi.
1. while nuvi attached to computer, go into Garmin/POI folder and delete a .gpi file(s)
2. let POI Loader delete all custom POIs.

How did you wind up deleting the file?

Rather than try to recover the file, are you able to do a new run of POI Loader to restore it?

He deleted the file. It was an error on his part. Why do you think you have to find out every little detail? Let it be!

--
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy, 35th U.S. president

Good post...

one can never too cautious with the "delete" command.

When in doubt I simply rename any .gpi files to .ipg and carry on as per the the words of the captain of the Titanic; "Damn the icebergs, full speed ahead" (or words to that effect).

Too late to worry about how. Now it's about fixing it.

Box Car wrote:

He deleted the file. It was an error on his part. Why do you think you have to find out every little detail? Let it be!

I'm tempted to just put a +1 on your post, since it doesn't matter HOW the file was deleted. However, to actually add to the discussion, running POI Loader again won't help. The deleted file, if not mistaken, was the one that came with the unit and not downloaded. Therefore, POI Loader has nothing to replace. Southeastdriver should not attempt a file restore using WebUpdater but should instead run Recuva on his dēzl to try and retrieve the file.

--
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job." --Douglas Adams

thanks

im during it right now. using Recuva try to recover the files. yes is my fault to deleted those gpi files. I contact garmin hopefully there help there. if not, I guess ill have to buy. redownload etc. Ill give this a try for now.... thanks

Recycle Bin?

Is it possible for the file to be in the recycle bin? If the nuvi was mounted as a harddrive and the file were deleted, it may have ended up in there and all you would need to do is Restore it from the bin.

--
Streetpilot C340 Nuvi 2595 LMT

POI Loader bypasses the

POI Loader bypasses the Recycle Bin and totally deletes the file.

--
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job." --Douglas Adams

Hate to bring this up (but going to anyway)...

Strephon_Alkhalikoi wrote:

POI Loader bypasses the Recycle Bin and totally deletes the file.

But it may actually matter HOW the file was deleted. If southeastdriver manually deleted the file, would it still bypass the recycle bin? Otherwise, it could possibly be restored back to the nuvi.

Otherwise, as you had mentioned, if POI Loader was used to remove it, then it would bypass the bin.

By looking at southeastdriver's posts I wasn't completely clear on how the files were deleted, so there may be a slight possibility (hopefully) that the file can be easily recovered.

--
Streetpilot C340 Nuvi 2595 LMT

The file is gone

He used poi loader so it is gone. It bypasses (as has been said) the recycle bin.

--
Nuvi 650 and 1350.

How files are deleted in Windows

@Shrifty: The reason why how it was deleted doesn't matter is the same reason programs like Recuva are so useful.

When a file is deleted, regardless of whether it is in the Recycle Bin or not, the file is actually not removed from the hard drive. In the case of the Recycle Bin the pointers to the file in the Master Boot Record are rewritten so that the file appears in the Recycle Bin. Restoring from the Recycle Bin restores the file pointers to their original state.

When a file is "permanently" deleted what happens is that the pointers to the file are removed and the first letter of the file itself renamed with a special character that tells Windows that the space is eligible to be overwritten. As long as no write operations take place on that drive, a file that has been deleted can be recovered with near 100% certainty. If write operations occur, the chances of recovering the file decrease. The file, if it can be recovered after a write operation, will likely be degraded to the point of being unusable.

--
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job." --Douglas Adams

a shame

That's a shame.

What kind of information was is in this trucker's POI file?

Howard

it is

HowardZ wrote:

That's a shame.

What kind of information was is in this trucker's POI file?

Howard

It is a listing of all the truck stops and the services provided at each location. It covers not only the chains such as Pilot and Loves but the independents as well.

--
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy, 35th U.S. president

Recuva

Strephon_Alkhalikoi wrote:

@Shrifty: The reason why how it was deleted doesn't matter is the same reason programs like Recuva are so useful.

When a file is deleted, regardless of whether it is in the Recycle Bin or not, the file is actually not removed from the hard drive. In the case of the Recycle Bin the pointers to the file in the Master Boot Record are rewritten so that the file appears in the Recycle Bin. Restoring from the Recycle Bin restores the file pointers to their original state.

Although I agree that Recuva is an excellent program to use in recovering files, it is a bit excessive and not necessary if the file appears in the Recycle Bin. If the file is not there, THEN it would make sense to use this type of program.

The important thing is, southeastdriver, were you able to recover the file?

--
Streetpilot C340 Nuvi 2595 LMT

HOW still does not matter

However, you're missing the point. It doesn't matter how the database was deleted because the file is still on the drive. My last post mentions the Recycle Bin only to highlight the subtle difference in terms of how a hard drive functions between sending a file to the Recycle Bin, and outright deleting it from the drive. That difference is with the file pointers. Files sent to the Recycle Bin have their pointers rewritten. Deleted files have their pointers deleted and the file name changed.

Of course he wouldn't need Recuva if the file was in the Recycle Bin and I never said he would need Recuva in that instance. However POI Loader ignores the Recycle Bin, and southeastdriver used POI Loader to delete his database. Therefore he needed to use Recuva to retrieve the missing file. In response to my mentioning Recuva southeastdriver did say he was using it.

I suspect he got his file back since there were no write operations performed on that drive after deleting the .GPI file.

--
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job." --Douglas Adams

Check out other Operating Systems, please

Strephon_Alkhalikoi wrote:

Of course he wouldn't need Recuva if the file was in the Recycle Bin and I never said he would need Recuva in that instance. However POI Loader ignores the Recycle Bin, and southeastdriver used POI Loader to delete his database. Therefore he needed to use Recuva to retrieve the missing file. In response to my mentioning Recuva southeastdriver did say he was using it.

I am running XP SP3 and am fairly confident that the OpSys will not make a difference but I need to ask.

We have been talking about POI Loader bypassing the Recycle Bin and deleting a file directly putting it into the Recycle Bin (assuming that SHIFT was not held down).

On my PC - if I delete a file from Garmin Nuvi (H:)\Garmin\POI - it does not show up in my Recycle Bin. All I see is my C: drive.

Under Properties > Global for my Recysle Bin, I have "Use one setting for all drives" checked.

By the way, I think that my Nuvi writes several files every time it is is turned on.

Do any other OpSys show the nuvi drive (assuming it is attached to the PC) as part of the Recycle Bin?

Flash Memory Has No Recycle Bin

I was wondering when someone would bring that up. Flash memory devices don't get a Recycle Bin entry, thus the files are always "permanently" deleted. This applies to XP, Vista, 7 or 8. The Recycle Bin would come into play if you were to do as I do, and manually delete the .GPI files from the hard drive instead of using POI Loader.

POI Loader only deletes files from the GPS itself and not the hard drive. Thus the Recycle Bin discussion is intended only to show the difference between deleting to the Recycle Bin and what POI Loader actually does.

Regarding the GPS writing data on every start, it depends on what is being written. If a file is updated it's written to the same spot on the hard drive. If however the file size were to change, the file is still overwritten but the portion that doesn't fit in the allocated space for the old version of the file gets sent to the first open spot on the drive. Thus you have a fragmented file.

Defragging flash memory isn't recommended because it can increase the amount of wear on the memory because it's rewriting files constantly during the defragmenting process and also because solid state memory accesses all sectors of the drive at equal rates. However, you still get fragmented files on flash memory devices because of how DOS and Windows write files.

--
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job." --Douglas Adams

POI Loader deletes trucking database

I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded and NOT under the heading of custom POI. Now it is gone. Can anyone tell me how/where to download the NTTS POI. Thanks.

POI Loader

gmccool wrote:

I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded and NOT under the heading of custom POI. Now it is gone. Can anyone tell me how/where to download the NTTS POI. Thanks.

It shouldn't delete the gpi or gpx files in the GPX folder, but it does delete everything in the POI folder of the device. That's what mine does.

--
NUVI40 Kingsport TN

oops

Deleted post exclaim

--
NUVI40 Kingsport TN

first off

gmccool wrote:

I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded and NOT under the heading of custom POI. Now it is gone. Can anyone tell me how/where to download the NTTS POI. Thanks.

Welcome to the site.

As to recovering the NTTS database, you have two options. The first is to attempt to recover the file using a utility like RECUVA. The second is to find a fellow trucker that has a DEZL and will let you copy the file. Another user posting here with the same problem stated Garmin had told him the file was not available for download from them.

Once you have recovered the file (in fact, I'd do it right now), I'd do a backup of your unit. Search Backup and you will find many different discussions on this site all dealing with the subject of backup and the consequences of not having one.

--
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy, 35th U.S. president

Wow

U got lucky

Maybe I can help

gmccool wrote:

I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded and NOT under the heading of custom POI. Now it is gone. Can anyone tell me how/where to download the NTTS POI. Thanks.

If you still don't have the files, I can send them to you later tonight.

--
KD5XB in DM84

???

gmccool wrote:

I discovered that the Garmin POI Loader, the one that can be downloaded from the Garmin web site, will delete the trucking database, if you command it to delete all custom POI's. I had thought this would not happen, since the trucking POI's are pre-loaded and NOT under the heading of custom POI. Now it is gone. Can anyone tell me how/where to download the NTTS POI. Thanks.

Did you simply copy my first post in this thread, with only a slight change? Do you really need these files, or are you just "joshing" us a bit???

--
KD5XB in DM84

Files reloaded

Yes I really needed the files. I was able to get Garmin to reload the files into my dezl560LMT. after talking to Garmin I found that the files are encripted with the device S/N so transfering them from one device to another will not work. Garmin does not have these files anywhere on their site anymore. You have to call softwear support to get them. They are not sure how much longer they will have access to them. Garmin is NO longer supporting this product.

In that case, ...

gmccool2 wrote:

Yes I really needed the files. I was able to get Garmin to reload the files into my dezl560LMT. after talking to Garmin I found that the files are encripted with the device S/N so transfering them from one device to another will not work. Garmin does not have these files anywhere on their site anymore. You have to call softwear support to get them. They are not sure how much longer they will have access to them. Garmin is NO longer supporting this product.

In that case, I even more strongly than normal suggest that you make a computer or DVD backup of your device!

Thank you

Yes, I have already made a backup of the full GPS. I will not make this mistake again. I would like to thank everyone for the help. grin

No more updates ??

gmccool2 wrote:

... They are not sure how much longer they will have access to them. Garmin is NO longer supporting this product.

Does that mean you should not expect any updates to the NTTS file any more?

--
Zumo 665, (2) Nuvi 765Ts & 1450LMT | 2005 Harley Road King, Black Cherry Pearl / Black Pearl

No More Updates ???

During my day, I drive a charter bus. I use the NTTS files all the time with my Dezl.

Hard to believe that Garmin no longer supports these for the Dezl?

--
As I was going up a stair ...

I have all three files in my

I have all three files in my dezl 760lmt and truckdown still does not work.

I wish someone would email

I wish someone would email me the NTTS files I have TruckDown And they dont work.
kb5rir1@yahoo.com
Thanks Fellow Truckers..

they can't

kb5rir wrote:

I wish someone would email me the NTTS files I have TruckDown And they dont work.
kb5rir1@yahoo.com
Thanks Fellow Truckers..

According to a post just up from this, the files are keyed to a unit so copying them from one to another won't make the data available. The deleting of the installed POI files was corrected about a year ago with one of the last two updates to POI Loader.

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ɐ‾nsǝɹ Just one click away from the end of the Internet

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