Is it legal to sexually harass someone as long as you're a TSA agent?
TSA to investigate body scan resister
If I understand this correctly, air travelers options are:
- expose ourselves to a small dose of radiation or
- be humiliated/sexually molested or
- be prosecuted and penalized for refusing to do either one
Is this still the land of the free?
Because one option is to drive to your location...
I say go ahead. But don't do a half a**ed job!
Opt out completely and STAY AWAY from the airport!
If you don't wish to submit to the required security procedures, then don't fly. It's as simple as that. Nobody is forcing you to fly, and there is no right to fly that you are being denied. If you choose to fly, there are certain rules that you must abide by.
This same rule applies to all aspects of life. Whatever I choose to do, there are certain rules presented by the society that I live in, that I must abide by. Those rules constrain me in ways that I may not like, but I must submit to be part of society.
You can do what ever you want but I will not submit to thugs.
There has been allot more car bombs then Airplanes bombs.
So How long will it be before TSA is sitting at the end of driveway for a cavaity/auto search.
what does this subject have to do with GPS units? Because one option is to drive to your location...
But I always welcome a good discussion
Here in France, we call that "Le Bar du Commerce" - the Neighborhood Pub Club"
Actually enjoy traveling by train or boat. It will not last long. Soon we will be "protected" in those too.
Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano says terrorists will continue to look for U.S. vulnerabilities, making tighter security standards necessary.
“[Terrorists] are going to continue to probe the system and try to find a way through,” Napolitano said in an interview that aired Monday night on "Charlie Rose."
“I think the tighter we get on aviation, we have to also be thinking now about going on to mass transit or to trains or maritime. So, what do we need to be doing to strengthen our protections there?”
Were you really so naive to think that government will leave alone other means of travel after they will be done with flying? If so, I have ocean view property for you to buy in Mojave Desert. Cheaply.
And my wild guess will be, that once they will be done with mass transit there will be need to control cars on the highways. You know, those terrorist in old Buicks and Toyotas hauling bombs across country. We can't have this. And maybe surprising rides of private homes? After all, if you have nothing to hide... And if it saves even one life...
I think we should be more like Israel.
I agree, but isn't it sad when American's want to be like another county. Remember when other countries wanted to be like America?
My ask what does the TSA Post have to do with POIs ?
I guess the answer to your question is that it was posted on an OPEN forum. It was a conversation piece.
Heard from local radio that TSA is hiring...
anyone is interested in performing the job?
oh. BTW, only US citizens are eligible to apply.
So many are complaining that the government is taking away your freedom. I hate to differ with you but the gov. is trying to protect you from those who are trying to kill you. Complain to them.
Some people here might know which document the following sentence was taken from.
- "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated" -
If the word 'unreasonable' is rendered meaningless in the interests of safety, then the whole sentence becomes meaningless.
It becomes another aspect of life that has been cast into the ash-bin of history in the name of progress.
Oh brave new world that has such people in it.
...if you haven't written your Senators and your Congressional representative, and you think TSA should do more profiling and less strip-searching, it's easy to do. Just google your representatives and go to their "Contact us" page. Each has a form you fill out with your name, address, email, subject (Transportation), and a box to write up your comments. All it takes is THREE emails, two senators, one Congress person...and you're done. The more they hear from their subjects, er district members, the more they'll know you care.
The more they hear from their subjects, er district members, the more they'll know you care.
One of the things that amazes me is the some talking-heads I see on TV are so gung-ho for this TSA security are also dead-set against securing our borders. Ironic. And hard to figure out.
If they started making the big wigs - Senators, Congresspeople, Michelle Obama, etc. put up with this stuff it would stop. Immediately. They're all immune to having this crap happen to them so it doesn't bother them at all. Make it happen for EVERYBODY and it will "suddenly" be a big deal.
I have a 10-year-old granddaughter. I DO NOT want some TSA perv peeping her in the scanner or fondling her crotch. Period. In my mind, anybody who did something like that should be shot.
It's because the borders are a long way from where they live.......whereas those planes have a good chance of being over their house when something goes wrong.
Should women be checking gay dudes and men lesbians?
How about a gay/lesbian TSA worker - should they be allowed to fondle someone of the same sex?
I found it humerous (sad) that they managed to find a way to need to do an 'enhanced pat down' on a woman in a wheelchair who showed up wearing only a bra and panties!!!
I read the story at the link at it sounded like she was denied access to her flight because of "nitrates" on her wheelchair. The story does not mention a "pat down" as part of this screening, just that she was denied access to the flight.
I think there is a lot more "smoke" than "fire" in this story. True, there is a fire there, but judging by the newscasts of the "non-activity" on "opt out day" it seems more of a media story than an event concerning most people. We talk about it because the media covers it, then the media covers it more because people talk about it, and so on, ad nauseum.
Most of the time I think I'm in sync with the rest of the world. And then there's the times when I'm not.
I just watched the TV news, wherein everybody is outraged about the new body scanners and pat-downs as they go through airport security.
I'm not criticizing those people, but I travel all the time and I don't feel that way at all.
On the contrary.
Scan me. Search me. Bend me over. Stick your finger in my ear. Do anything you absolutely have to do.
I'll get over it.
Here's what I won't get over:
Yes, I know, the body scanners are an invasion of privacy. Yes, I have gone through them at three airports so far. And yes, TSA guys have already seen my ten-year-old underwire and my saggy white Carter's, not to mention my butt mole.
And you know what?
They may not have. At least, they have indigestion or nightmares, and I feel for them.
In fact, I'd like to bring a little sunshine into the life of those TSA types. All they get to do is look at driver's license photos all day long. Can you imagine how much that stinks, especially given how we all look on our driver's licenses?
So here's what I say: Check it out, TSA dude. Knock yourself out. If looking at my scanned body does it for you, you have bigger problems than terrorists.
I've also had the new and improved pat-down, and I'm a fan.
Er, I mean, I'm not opposed.
Was it intrusive? You bet. I've had dates that didn't get as far, and they'd bought me dinner. I felt embarrassed, giggly, and silly.
How could I not? Someone I hardly know got to second base with me, in Terminal A. And you know how long it lasted?
I forget, how long are you dead for?
Now, I'm betting that most of the people bothered by the security scanning are women, at least they were on the news. It makes sense to me. We're congenitally modest, and even if we're not, we tend to worry about someone running their fingertips over our muffintops. I feel the same way. This would be a good time to let you know that I sucked in my stomach during my pat-down. I wanted my TSA date to think I was thin. He might not ask me out again.
The women on the TV news said that the pat-downs had no "dignity," but here's what I have to say to my fellow sisters, which might be a paradox:
Remember when you gave birth? Remember when you were in labor? Remember when you were in the hospital gown, with your butt hanging out and your legs in the air? Plus you were at least fifty pound heavier and retaining more water than most swimming pools.
You sweated, you grunted, you cursed, and you know what else happened.
I wasn't the only new mom who left a present on the delivery table.
If you don't know what I mean, you're lucky. If you haven't yet given birth, you'll understand, someday. Recall that I warned you.
And you're welcome.
So anyway, here's why this matters.
If you were dignified before you gave birth, you cannot tell me that labor and delivery didn't cure you. Half the world saw you naked and as undignified as it gets. And oh yeah, another human being popped out of your body.
I never understand people who say that childbirth is beautiful. This would be another time I'm out of sync. Childbirth is not beautiful. Children are beautiful. Childbirth is disgusting. Anyone who says otherwise has never met a placenta.
I'm surprised ob-gyns don't have post-traumatic distress from seeing a few of those a day.
The only thing we can all agree on is that childbirth is a miracle, but that doesn't change my analysis. As miracles go, it's easily the most disgusting. For example, the parting of the Red Sea would be cool to see. Also pulling a sword out of a stone. And most other miracles.
Especially getting on a plane and getting off safely, all of us, forever.
That's the one I want to see.
Best post I've ever read in this or any forum. Thank you for making my day! I'm going to have to check out some more stuff from her.
it didn't use to be so troubling to fly before 9-11 but now it just gets tougher and tougher. I didn't enjoy flying before and it's making me consider not flying unless it's absolutely necessary.
I've had dates that didn't get as far, and they'd bought me dinner.
"She was given an "enhanced" pat down because she was in a wheelchair."
I think the late George Carlin put it best when he said that all they can provide is "the illusion of security".
I'm not suggesting that security procedures be completely abandoned, but that terorists will ALWAYS be able to get SOMETHING onto their targets, one way or another.
However the TSA has gone overboard and, as others have suggested, adopting procedures similar to those used by the Israelis is the solution - the thug approach practiced in the US is ineffective and intrusive, not to mention a violation of the constitution.
He also pointed out that drug dealers also seem to have an uncanny ability to get their packages onto planes as well.
The problem is that too many people have access; Whether it is the cleaner or a technician, the reality is that one can always get *something* past security, if only by tossing it over a fence or submersing it in a tank of fuel or similar - and when that fails, these guys also seem to have missiles and grenade launchers, which can be be used almost anywhere, as evidenced by the following:
On the subject of constitutionality of methods, TSA solved that potential hurdle when it was moved to the Department of Homeland Security in 2003. The courts have basically ruled that the DHS is basically immune to such silly restrictions from a document as outdated and worthless as the Constitution, right?
In all seriousness, I'm surprised this thread got zombied, but it is an interesting topic. I just wish it didn't take such a brazen invasion of privacy to get widespread conversations about privacy concerns.
You can take another form of transportation
Please feel free to drive, or swim to Hawaii...
I suppose Chuckles the Clown's tome today would be:
A little song, a little dance
A little TSA down your pants
Reading the posts on the TSA topic has definitely done one thing for me......It's made me glad that I live in a Country that allows this type of open dialogue to go on!!
Our Country is not perfect, but, It's a d#$ site better than anything else I've seen!
There's always the bus? train?
There's buzz about the free TSA physicals being expanded to include train stations and bus depots.
Present day TSA scanners and pat downs will become obsolete if explosives are surgically inserted into the body cavity. If this insane technique becomes a reality, a full dose radiation x-ray w/ a tin foil thong will be necessary. Driving w/ Jill is starting to look like the safest option.
Why stop at busses and trains? We can do security checkpoints on cars as well.
Indeed, TSA-like screenings could easily be easily extended to other forms of transit. If the logic is to deal with terrorists and that simply arriving at an airport is consent to waive Fourth Amendment rights, the same logic could be applied to driving. After all, terrorists could and have used vehicles on public roadways to engage in acts of terror (Oklahoma City bombing is probably the most obvious example of an act of terror using a public road). In the name of preventing terrorist activities, TSA-like security checkpoints could be established on public roads with implied consent by simply being on the road.
We could even do security checkpoints on foot on public sidewalks, why not?
All of this is arguably irrelevant in terms of understanding historical context of the Constitution. The right to freely travel preexisted in this country was confirmed in the Articles of Confederation. Although the technology of flight certainly didn't exist, the law was not written to merely protect travel on foot throughout the States. The Ninth Amendment should have protected this preexisting right, but clearly even the Fourth and Ninth Amendments aren't enough to protect us here.
Many anti-Federalists were opposed to the Constitution because of lack of protection for non-enumerated rights. The Ninth Amendment was added to help appease them, but it's sad to confirm that their fears were valid even despite the amendment.
Not long ago you were protected form unreasonable searches and seizures. Physically. It's gone.
But you praise gov that they let you talk about it with your internet buddies. Even disagree. What a step forward.
But when gov will not allow talking about it what you gonna say? That you are still permitted to think about it?
Seems like you haven't seen much. Every country has irritating quirks, but TSA serves blatant assault on personal freedom. And on the end of this way lays dictatorship. Or something close to East Germany. After all they were called German Democratic Republic. And this one I have seen myself.
I'm repeating myself, but:
First off, let me say that ALL forms of security are just an illusion. The bad guys will always find a way to get around the security. Security has to be right all the time to be a success, the bad guys only have to be right once to be a success.
We can say that the present (and recent) security is a failure because it hasn't caught anything, but who can count how many would be bad guys have been deterred from even trying. And who knows how many bad guys have just disappeared in the night. The transportation industry doesn't want us to know about all the near misses because everyone would be scared to fly.
In today's world, I have a reasonable fear that anyone on the plane could be a bad guy determined to do me harm. I want every security measure possible to try to deter or thwart their efforts. I don't want to be an easy target for them. Now if anyone squawks at, or refuses the standard security measures, this gives even more reason to view them as a threat. My first thought is "what are they trying to hide?".
So if someone touches your junk you'd not consider that unreasonable search? Face it. Attitudes like yours are exactly what the terrorists want. It's because of attitudes such as yours that this farce is allowed to continue. Attitudes that are now going to be encouraged by the government. Consider the following link.
Up until today we've been confining our discussion to airports. Now we have this. Next will be police demanding to see your papers. Sound familiar?
That's the one I want to see.
You write the way I think!
People ought to get a life, and by the way that is what those TSA agents are trying to preserve while doing those oh so pervasive pat downs.
Being alive is so much better that being dead.
First off, I agree with you that the current system is a farce. I already stated that all security is an illusion. It is just a facade to make us feel safe. But, where we disagree is that I know that the charade must continue for the well being of the masses. If we were to stop the charade and only do things that are known to be 100% effective, then all h*** will break out.
I'm not concerned with them touching my junk because there is documented proof that this method has been used to smuggle explosives on-board a plane. Now the real bad guys most likely won't try that again, but the copy cat morons sure will. I have nothing to hide, so go ahead and search. And, I want them to search you too, because you might be hiding something. And the louder you protest, the more I believe that you have something to hide.
And on the link you provided, I'm having a hard time understanding what you object to. If someone overhears of a terrorism plot, don't you want them to report it? Or do you just want them telling you and your family so that they can be safe and let the rest of the world care for itself?
Or are you saying that our freedoms in this country extend to planning and executing an act of terror, and anything that gets in the way of that is a violation of our rights?
There are some very creative people out there:
Thanks PastorMC but I can't take credid for the writing it was sent to me by someone else but they didn't say who the author was I think it was well written.
Not so much objecting as pointing out that the country is quickly becoming that which its citizens have always despised. Thanks to the majority of citizens acting like sheep, believing that their government still works for them.
And please, cut the crap with the "yelling fire in a crowded theater" type questions. Speech like that has never been legally protected. The entire point is that the government is now encouraging its citizens to turn each other in if they hear anything that the citizen might believe is related to terrorism.
Expect persecution across the country of anyone looking like they come from the Middle East. In the South, expect persecution of all black people. In the Southwest, expect persecution of all Hispanic people. Even if terrorism charges are disproved, the very accusation will remain with them for the rest of their lives.
Land of the free? Yes, as long as you're White, Anglo-Saxon, and Protestant. Now you tell me, does that not sound familiar? Because alarms are going off in my head as I draw the parallels with history, and this is a very dark road we are headed down.
Grandma got molested at the airport...
That was a good one funny .
How about just using mans best friend, a dog. Station a guard with a blood hound at the gate, the main entrance and a roaming dog and guard walking through the air port.
Is your argument against asking the public to be alert and report suspicious activity so weak that you have to try and pull the race card? You loose all credibility when you pull that alarmist/extremist stunt.
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