Drive models and red light cameras

 

Has anyone got any experience of the new Drive models and 3rd party red light/speed cameras? There are reports on a UK forum that Garmin has removed that ability from their Drive models and that they only support Garmin speed cameras?

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Goodness!

What terrible news if true. We should have folks here who can test this and report back today, I bet.

Both speed and red light?

sussamb, are you saying that both red light and speed camera alerts loaded by POI Loader to Drive models do not work in the UK?

It is possible that Garmin may have some reason to disable this feature for Drive models in the UK. I hope this does not apply to the US.

dobs108 smile

Garmin.

I sure hope that is incorrect, as it would be a REALLY STUPID move on Garmin's part. They are having enough trouble competing with apps, and removing features will not help.

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Alan - Android Auto, DriveLuxe 51LMT-S, DriveLuxe 50LMTHD, Nuvi 3597LMTHD, Oregon 550T, Nuvi 855, Nuvi 755T, Lowrance Endura Sierra, Bosch Nyon

Well ...

... It's what one person is reporting in the UK, but no verification yet hence my query. I'm getting a drive model at the weekend, refurb at half price, meaning to do so for a while and the offer was too good to miss, so I'll test it properly once I have it.

Just thought there might be someone here who might know. I agree IF it's true it's a bad move on Garmins part, but it's only an IF at the moment.

Note if it is true it's the latest 2017 models, 51/61, and not the earlier 50/60 ones.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

refurb?

2017 51/61 models available already as refurbs in UK? Or is this a perk you get as a Garmin moderator? wink Which model are you getting?

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Alan - Android Auto, DriveLuxe 51LMT-S, DriveLuxe 50LMTHD, Nuvi 3597LMTHD, Oregon 550T, Nuvi 855, Nuvi 755T, Lowrance Endura Sierra, Bosch Nyon

so...

How in the world would a Garmin device know what the contents of a POI file for red-light / speedcam might be..

If they are simply checking the name, name the files "Mickey" & "Minney" and see what it does...

I suspect this is just some poor person not really knowing how to set it up properly..

But then again.. What would an old fart like me know? mrgreen

Am I that technologically challenged?? Hmmmm... mrgreen

--
Never argue with a pig. It makes you look foolish and it anoys the hell out of the pig!

Yeah .... I Agree

BarneyBadass wrote:

How in the world would a Garmin device know what the contents of a POI file for red-light / speedcam might be..

If they are simply checking the name, name the files "Mickey" & "Minney" and see what it does...

I suspect this is just some poor person not really knowing how to set it up properly......................

Wouldn't be the first time!

--
If the only tool you have is a hammer, every problem quickly resembles a nail. (Maslow's Hammer)

Yes ...

... That's my thought too although the person who reported it has had it working correctly on a nuvi for years smile

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Well ...

alandb wrote:

2017 51/61 models available already as refurbs in UK? Or is this a perk you get as a Garmin moderator? wink Which model are you getting?

Sorry, slightly misleading, the refurb is a 50LMT-D model!

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

What is a garmin moderator?

alandb wrote:

...is this a perk you get as a Garmin moderator? wink

What is a Garmin moderator, and is that what sussamb is?

dobs108 neutral

Garmin Moderator

dobs108 wrote:
alandb wrote:

...is this a perk you get as a Garmin moderator? wink

What is a Garmin moderator, and is that what sussamb is?

dobs108 neutral

To answer your question, member sussamb
is a moderator on the https://forums.garmin.com/forum.php

We are fortunate to have his knowledge in this forum.
Although he is located in the UK he gives us hie expertise regarding Garmin GPS's.

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Nuvi 2460LMT 2 Units

Would think...

Even if they could or would disable poi files with certain words/names it would seem so easy to just rename or change out words in question.

Well said & so true

muell9k wrote:

To answer your question, member sussamb
is a moderator on the https://forums.garmin.com/forum.php

We are fortunate to have his knowledge in this forum.
Although he is located in the UK he gives us hie expertise regarding Garmin GPS's.

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Nüvi 255WT with nüMaps Lifetime North America born on 602117815 / Nüvi 3597LMTHD born on 805972514 / I love Friday’s except when I’m on holidays ~ canuk

Could be done

They would have to disable the proximity alerts for everything.

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d

Update ...

The user that reported this issue has now copied a known working .gpi file from a nuvi and installed it in his Drive 51. No speed cam alerts. He's spoken to Garmin, who reportedly have told him that 3rd party speed cameras won't work on the latest Drive models. This is a route already started by TomTom a while back.

If true those who want to use their GPS with speed camera files will need to buy one of the older models.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

speed cameras

So this only applies to speed cameras and not red light cameras. It is still unclear whether US units are the same way.

I assume speed cameras are common in the UK and the fine is substantial. Does the government have anything to do with this?

dobs108 smile

Any ...

Both speed and red light cameras. Not sure about whether the fine is considered substantial, it's 3 points on your licence and £100 generally ... you need to rack up 12 points before you're banned from driving but there are plenty of other ways to get penalty points.

It would be good if someone in the US who uses 3rd party camera warnings could confirm this, I have someone else with a new 2017 model also now checking so will report back when he's also tried to use 3rd party speed/red light camera POIs.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

all proximity alerts

If third party red light camera alerts cannot be loaded to these units that must also mean that all proximity alerts will not work, because a red light camera alert is nothing but a basic proximity alert.

This also has to be tested. When running POI Loader, it recognizes red light camera files if the text string redlight is in the filename, but this is not required. It would be possible to rename a red light camera POI file to any other name and still load it to work in the desired way, to alert when approaching a camera.

dobs108 smile

POI loader help

In posting in this thread I checked POI Loader Help. It has been updated and is much improved:

http://www8.garmin.com/products/poiloader/creating_custom_po...

Yes ...

I looked at that too and it says

Except for the basic handhelds and older Rino® 2-way radio GPS devices, all current outdoor and automotive products are compatible with Custom POIs

so it seems it should work with the Drive units, but it's not clear when it was last updated.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Agreed

dobs108 wrote:

If third party red light camera alerts cannot be loaded to these units that must also mean that all proximity alerts will not work, because a red light camera alert is nothing but a basic proximity alert.

Agreed, and I suspect simple red light alerts will still work, but speed alerts work differently and it's quite possible that Garmin have disabled them, just as TomTom have done.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

speed camera alerts

sussamb wrote:

...I suspect simple red light alerts will still work, but speed alerts work differently and it's quite possible that Garmin have disabled them, just as TomTom have done.

If that is the case it isn't a problem. We can load speed camera POIs as simple proximity alerts. These would alert whether or not the speed is exceeded.

dobs108 smile

ok... ill bite.. nipple nipple nipple :)

sussamb wrote:

The user that reported this issue has now copied a known working .gpi file from a nuvi and installed it in his Drive 51. No speed cam alerts.

WHAT? This doesn't sound logical... I must be missing something obvious

sussamb wrote:

He's spoken to Garmin, who reportedly have told him that 3rd party speed cameras won't work on the latest Drive models.

Just outa blind curisioty, is this doc'd somewhere on Garmins site.. I've looked around n' couldn't find it...

sussamb wrote:

This is a route already started by TomTom a while back.

Can some kind soul elucidate me as how one of these devices can differiencate a speed / RLC location from say a wall-mart, in-n-out, or even your home address or other saved places?

Do we suspect municipalities threatened Garmin for loss of income from these so called "Safty" devices?

Do we think municipalities threatened Garmin with aiding and abetting people in violating laws?

Has anyone asked about the logic behind disabling these alerts just so we understand the rational?

I'll admit I'm completely stumped.

sussamb wrote:

If true those who want to use their GPS with speed camera files will need to buy one of the older models.

Thanks for the info.. I'm 1/2 way tempted to get one just to hack the stew out of it to see if we can't beat it into submission to behave properly.....

But right now I'm in a part of the country where there aren't very many of these "Safety" devices so testing them specifically would take some real work as well as travel.

Hmmm... Do these new models have access to the internet so how.. Maybe through the smartphone data link and that's how they are disabling the POI's?

What will the geniuses at Garmin dream up next?

--
Never argue with a pig. It makes you look foolish and it anoys the hell out of the pig!

I think ...

... if they're doing it (and it's still an IF) then they could simply be looking at the POI and knocking out anything with speed info in the poi file, that of course as pointed out above wouldn't work if it was simply a POI with no speed info, so there is a way around that.

And no, it's not documented (yet?) as far as I can tell.

However worth repeating this is one report from one user, until we get confirmation from more users it's still only a possibility and not fact smile

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Always a work around

Unless Garmin goes the route of locking their bootloader there will always be someone who can hack the firmware and get around such a "block". And in the US it is unlikely we'll see a reduction in functionality on new models - having such a feature is't illegal and competition (from GPS and Radar Detector mfrs) will see to that.

Well ...

... It's not illegal here either, and they face stiff competition from phone apps so the logic of it escapes me, so I'm still waiting to get corroboration smile

--
Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Garmin does have a caveat on the Drive models page

"5 Red light and speed camera warnings are not available in all regions"

But they do offer the Cyclops POI database for the UK and Scotland, so.... you'd think you'd be able to load your own safety camera POI as well.

https://buy.garmin.com/en-GB/GB/p/68120

and

http://www.garmin.com/en-GB/maps/updates

And ...

... You always have been able to in the past. Still waiting to have this corroborated, my feeling is that it's not true but ... wink

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

If true, seems like a bad move

I'll have to keep an eye on this as I was in the market for a new gps...

uh oh...

LeapFroggie wrote:

But they do offer the Cyclops POI database for the UK and Scotland, so.... you'd think you'd be able to load your own safety camera POI as well.

https://buy.garmin.com/en-GB/GB/p/68120

and

http://www.garmin.com/en-GB/maps/updates

And there's this too

https://explore.garmin.com/en-US/drive/

I did see where it was doc'ed all drive models are loaded with Cyclops safety cam data when delivered..

So who knows what evil is in the minds of those fine folks at a GPS factory..

Ain't it just grand?

Here's what the us drivelix saidThis premium 5-inch glass pinch-to-zoom GPS navigator features an elegant metal design and secure magnetic mount to quickly stow and go. It includes helpful driver alerts and built-in Wi-Fi® for easy software and map updates. It also includes Bluetooth® hands-free calling1 and onscreen smart notifications2 so your hands remain on the wheel. Garmin DriveLuxe is preloaded with detailed maps of North America with free lifetime updates3 plus free live traffic4. From your daily commute to cross-country trips, real-time information2 such as weather and parking4 makes for a much smarter drive. Also, view preloaded data from TripAdvisor® so you can find ratings for travel points of interest, such as hotels, restaurants and attractions. The Smartphone Link app enables LiveTrack, which lets drivers share their location so friends can track your whereabouts whether you are running errands around town or taking a long road trip. What’s more, if an incident occurs, your navigator can automatically send a text message1 with a location link to your predetermined friend.

--
Never argue with a pig. It makes you look foolish and it anoys the hell out of the pig!

Resolved

I believe this issue is now resolved, as the person who reported this decided to switch his 2017 Drive 51 for a 2016 Drive 50.

He now reports he is still unable to get 3rd party cameras to work whereas others can, despite the fact he stated he had no issues using the same file on his older nuvi, so it certainly appears like user error somewhere on his part!!

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

Thanks sussamb.

Good news to hear that Garmin didn't do something that stupid.

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Alan - Android Auto, DriveLuxe 51LMT-S, DriveLuxe 50LMTHD, Nuvi 3597LMTHD, Oregon 550T, Nuvi 855, Nuvi 755T, Lowrance Endura Sierra, Bosch Nyon

but

alandb wrote:

Good news to hear that Garmin didn't do something that stupid.

I'm more n' convinced something like this isn't beyond em' to implement!

--
Never argue with a pig. It makes you look foolish and it anoys the hell out of the pig!

Confirmed!

Now heard back from someone with a 2017 DriveLuxe 51. Red light and speed camera POIs load and work fine.

All Garmin has apparently done is move the Proximity Alert menu into a new menu option called Driver assistance - they show there under Proximity Alerts.

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

so it's the nut behind the wheel!

So it's the nut behind the wheel!

dobs108 razz

In this case ...

... Yep smile

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Where there's a will ... there's a way ... DriveSmart50LMT-D, Nuvi 2508LMT-D, 1490LMT, 1310, Montana 650T, Etrex 20

RATZ!!!

I wanted to have something to hack...

Maybe use a hammer thinking it was a cell phone and I needed to secure it!!

--
Never argue with a pig. It makes you look foolish and it anoys the hell out of the pig!

Works on mine too

sussamb wrote:

Now heard back from someone with a 2017 DriveLuxe 51. Red light and speed camera POIs load and work fine.

DriveAssist 51 LMT-S