Bestbuy Sends Garmin a Message

Or those evil money grubbers at Garmin told them to pull them so they could fix a known issue with a product in a line of many.

Asking retailers to pull the affected units from sale until the problem was under control and fixes applied was the right thing for Garmin to do.

my question is, who ordered the yanking of the units, garmin or best buy?

Still waiting for the price drop of a 765T or an 885T.... If they pulled all the units, it may not happen soon.

Paid $525 for a 760, only to see it go down to less than 200 one year later... hate to pay ~$350 for a 765T and have it drop soon after.

Larry

My guess would be Garmin...the 765t, 855, and 885t aren't showing up at Amazon, either.

I would have to say Best buy ordered the Nuvi's off their shelves. (Didn't want to hassle with the returns)

Just too many other retailers still selling them. Locally and online.

...with those units?

The main topics:

http://www.poi-factory.com/node/23396

http://www.poi-factory.com/node/23332

Didn't read those previously because I've got a 750. Empathy to all those inconvenienced with this!

Posted earlier in this thread: "My guess would be Garmin...the 765t, 855, and 885t aren't showing up at Amazon, either."

Add to the list of Nuvis currently NOT available at Amazon: 755, 850, 880

I agree with another comment, that Garmin has most likely removed all 6 of the above referenced Nuvis from the market (or at least recommended to Best Buy and Amazon that THEY do so). I noticed that at least one other online vendor now lists several of the 7x5 and 8x5 units as "sold out."

Surprisingly, however, Costco.com does continue to offer the 855 for sale, despite the recent spurt of VERY NEGATIVE Costco's online reviews for this product:

Of 29 reviews posted at Costco.online since June 18, 19 of them have SPECIFICALLY cited that it "freezes up," or will no longer "power on." This is an abysmal level of performance, and such a number obviously means these 855s were defective. I note that these "freezes" began occuring BEFORE the 755/765 fiasco of June 23.

I am surprised that Costco has not realized that so many customers have complained about their 855s (and apparently returned them to Costco, as very disappointed customers): I would have expected that Costco would have posted some sort of warning about the 855 on their ad for the product, and/or contacted each of the reviewers to offer to re-sell them a new 855, once Garmin applies a reliable fix. Then again, one cannot know what Costco may actually know, or be doing, to correct this situation.

[On the other hand, the Costco.com sale of the 855 is supposed to end July 5...and I would not be surprised to see that item continued past that date; Costco already extended it once, when it was supposed to end June 15.]

I really consider myself very lucky that my 855 (purchased in early June, at the $249 price) functions very well, but I am also wary whether this will continue. I did install the Garmin software update to version 4.6. I suspect that my "fingers will be crossed" for the lifetime of this unit!

I have enjoyed my 755t much more than my 750.

I just picked up a 765T from BestBuy last night. On sale for $349, as advertised in last Sunday's insert. They had issued me a raincheck earlier in the week. The manager of the car audio/GPS department told me that all the BestBuys in the area had sold out of the 765T, but they had eight on order, hence the raincheck. He never received any directions from corporate to pull any units off the shelves. With the problems that the unit was having, I was very doubtful that BestBuy would be getting any units in at all, but lo and behold!, three days later there it was.

Tech support at Garmin has told me that when I register the unit, the firmware and map updates will load through Webupdater. I'll do that today, before I acquire any satellites.

In the meantime, I ordered a friction mount (non-plyable) for $25, a leather carrying case for $13 and a 2010 map update for $57, all through Amazon. The map update is for my 340c, which now goes to my wife.

I think it is much broader than what has been discussed here. The there is also another line missing from the Best Buy line up. The Zumo 550 and 660. Although Best Buy is listed as a reseller for these products you will not find them listed in their computer at all.

What has happened is anybody's guess. Perhaps Best Buy pulled the plug on troubled units until Garmin get their act together.

We can only hope.

I would like to see some proof on this statement, where did you hear this or read this. hearsay doesn't work here!

Crapola firmware, causing units to brick

Does anyone know if the Nuvi 780 affected by these same bugs that these other Nuvis are hit by?

Sorry I didn't make it clear BobDee. It was pure speculation on my part. I have no knowledge of what Garmin did or didn't do, but my statement represents what I think they should have done.

It seem amazon pull their nuvi 7xs series stock as well

Bet these will be back with the latest software and at a cheap price. Then new models will be available. Not real happy with my 5000, but the 680 works fine.

Well Said! It is time to start looking at other units.

that's nice

What issues have you been having with your 5000

I almost bought a 5000 before I got my 770. So far I have been very happy with my 770, works good. Of course this site has a lot to do with it. This site really does have all the answers!! Thanks everyone for all you do!

BobDee>>Crapola firmware

BobDee ... I've been on the road for awhile ... but it's nice to see you haven't changed in your universal condemnation of Garmin.

I really have to wonder why you even hang around here ... on the Garmin thread ... seeing as how you really, really don't like Garmin.

Well my 3 year old Nuvi 660 suddenly stopped picking up satellite signals when I went on a trip to Northern California - it was freezing up frequently the past few months before it went bonkers. So last 6/30 I went to Best Buy to pick-up a 765t and I found out it was pulled out from the Glendale and Pasadena stores. The Pasadena store proceeded to offer me the 885t for the price of 765t @ $349 which I welcomely took. It's just amazing how the technology prices dropped so drastically in just a few months time. I remember the 885t originally sells for almost $1,000. Now I'm happily navigating with it's effective voice command. Sweet!

Have had my 885t for about a month with no problems. Hopefully the mandatory update that came down on the 1st will fix the troubles others have had and i will avoid them all together. I really do like the unit.

I hope they get the problem fixed soon because I was going to buy a new unit.

The problems with the 7x5 and 8x5 units have been fixed with mandatory firmware updates available through Webupdater.

Should have never been broken in the first place. I hope this cost Garmin Big Bucks! I mean The real Big Bucks, then maybe they will get back to basics.

1) Design and Build a quality Product
2) make the customer happy
3) Make money for the company

NOT

1) Quality control,not a Value Added department "Fire them"
2) Make money for the company
3) Make even more money for the company!

You deserve better for you hard earned dollars, I have been preaching this was going to happen, just to get flamed by those that really didn't know any better.Mostly by first time GPS owners and brand loyalists.
I not one to Say I told ya so, However, I TOLD YOU SO!

The recall involves the Garmin nüvi 880 NA, 850, 885T, 855, 785T, 775T, 765T, and 755T; the Garmin GPSMAP-620 and GPSMAP-640; and the zumo 660 devices.

Recall? What recall? I do not remember reading in any news release that there was a "recall" on any of the units you listed. Which of the units that you listed do you actually own and have first hand knowledge of the problem. I know what a stickler you are when other people make comments or post opinions on units that they do not actually own.

In your own words from a earlier posting in this thread:

"I would like to see some proof on this statement, where did you hear this or read this. hearsay doesn't work here!"

Garmin definately need to get their act together.

Bob was quoting from an alleged Amazon email. I use alleged because I have not seen the email and can only report on what was stated.

The word "recall" is an extremely poor choice on the part of Amazon as it does not involve units to be pulled from service and returned to an authorized repair center. Units that are functional are required to download and install a software update that corrects a problem introduced when the GPS satellite timing database shifted causing some units to error, and in some cases lock up or "brick."

The resolution is not complicated, it involves opening the unit and removing the internal battery for approximately 30 seconds and then reassembling the unit and performing the software update. As warranties on some units can be affected, Garmin was requiring these units to be returned to their facility at the owner's cost.

I just had purchased an 885T on the day the problem occurred but I did not let it capture satellites until the 23rd of June as I wanted to install all my POI files and get the unit set up before initiating the warranty period and map updates. My unit was not affected. I did do the software update when it was released.

But you get down to it, BobDee has very little to say about almost any product that is positive. The one he was very positive about dropped out of the consumer market after about a year.

Having been previously involved in the automotive parts manufacturing business for 17 years, I can speak with some authority on what goes on in the manufacturing world. I have helped design Fuel Injectors and automotive Electronic Control Units. Some of these parts had features measured in the sub-micron range. I now work on ships that have a 1/4 inch tolerance on steel plate cuts for welding. All of my experience has been in design using 3D software programs.

Today's manufacturing world is in constant turmoil as emerging technologies are showing up almost daily. Every time one appears, there is a mad rush to be the "FIRST" on the market. There is a psychology behind this. Remember the IE vs. Netscape war? Netscape was a very popular browser because they were "First" with a lot of bells and whistles. IE was not even in the picture until Microsoft noticed that the internet was taking off. MS knew that a lot of users had a "Brand" loyalty to the first product they used. (You could see this with cars. If your parents drove a Chevy and that was the "first" car you drove, then you were more likely to buy a Chevy as your own first car) So MS started bundling IE with Windows and later made it uninstallable and claimed it was an neccesary part of the operating system (proved false in court later). This was aimed at getting new users to use IE first and therefore get their "Brand Loyalty". Ya know what? It worked, but there is still competion out there. Netscape is gone, but Mozilla carries on.

Back to GPSs. These battles still go on today. The company that first sells you a GPS will probably keep you as a customer. That is, unless they sell you a totaly bogus product that you cannot get replaced or repaired to your satisfaction.

From what I have read, Garmin sold folks a decent product. They did the right thing in correcting the software with updates, because they want to keep you as their customer. BUT, mistakes do happen and programmers sometimes create bugs when fixing bugs (MS is a fine example of that problem). At least Garmin supplied an update in a short amount of time and are trying to work with the customers.

Feel lucky that the issue was resolved quickly, I work with a 3D CAD program that takes up to a year to get some issues resolved. They priortize the problems. A few times we have gotten updates that we could not install, because the fix caused other problems (that were worse) and this is why we always thoroughly test each release. This is a problem with almost all current CAD software packages. Customers want more bells and whistles, so the seller complies. As the program gets more bloated with code, the more complex it gets and the more likely errors will be made. It also gets harder to diagnose the problems because of the complex code. And to top it off, we are using a version of the CAD package that is no longer being marketed. If we (and a few other companies) did not have so many seats on site, they would not be adding more bells and whistles for us, which is causing the bugs to be created.

I am very suspicious of the fact that all the units that failed were only on just 2 particular days. I am inclined to believe that this was intentionally done by a single person and that someone needs some help. Garmin probably had to thoroughly "Scrub" the code to be sure that there were not any other hidden harmful snippets of code and that is why it took a little while. They also had to get some field units to see what exactly happened to make them crash, so they would know where to look in the code.

I would be upset too, but as long as Garmin was willing to "Make things right", I would work with them.

Now, as to Garmin testing the code more thoroughly. Hmmmmmm, I guess the crystal ball would have told them to keep testing thru the end of June 2009, don't you.

Sorry I rambled and this was so long, but there is usually more to the story than people are sometimes willing to take the time to analyze. We are kind of spoiled by someone else doing the analysis for us in a 1/2 hour news show that trys to squeeze as much as possible into that time slot. And of course it has to be "Sensational" to keep our attention.

Sure sounds like a recall to me. You don't actually think that the retailers will be doing this themselves? Nope - they will be sent back and returned when fixed.

Dear mr a_user,
First off I am a garmin user and have been for years now, Just to get that in the open and Up front. I also do own several manufactured GPSr made by Garmin,Magellan,Delorme and Navigon.
Your right Navigon was my favorite, however they now just make built in automotive units and units for Europe.

With that out of the way, Garmin started the down hill decent with the release of the nuvi line. with this line they striped down all the streetpilots features and started to sell them back Ala'cart as many different models they have now. They also cheapend the the units body, and must have fired the programming staff that writes firmware.

Positive, Garmins,I like the Traffic receivers and like Navteq Maps a lot, it's what Garmin does with the data that sucks, traffic as well as maps, Like I said they must have fired the programmers. Navigon, Great Graphics, still a leader in apps for GPSr's even though not made for the American Market any longer. Magellan, probably the best GUI going. Delorme and Streets the best on the market by Far of any out there, if you don't mind having a Laptop on the front seat with you.

Negitives,
I say nothing about TomTom, why? I don't own one.
I say nothing negitive about Navaigon, why? Because they are awesome, I don't have a problem with mine, The negitive is a third party software application to run custom POI's.
Garmin, I have plenty to say about them, Why? because I own several of them and I can, they all have firmware updates time after time.! Magellan,just okay, custom POI clumsy, but ok.

Mr. User do you see this,and others not mentioned or obsoleted. I Buy and Sell Used GPSr's
I buy,sell trade and repair GPSr's.

No need for me to add or subtract on a daily or weekly basis just to make you happy!

If you bricked yours I'll take it off you hands and be sure to add it to my signature,before I resell it.

Enough with the guesses and such.

First of all.

THERE IS NO RECALL. THERE NEVER WAS A RECALL.

Garmin had an issue and in some cases the units would lock up. Garmin did not want to have people opening up units to disconnect batteries, so they did the partially honorable thing and will 'repair' affected units under warranty . . . how generous, especialy considering that all of the affectred units are pretty much under a year old anyway.

They did NOT offer to pay for the shipping back to their facility and that was just plain wrong - I have stopped following the topic (since only my Zumo 660 was affected and I had applied the patch to it), but if they have not agreed to pay for shipping both ways for affected units, then that is just plain wrong.

Affected units are on the Nuvi 2X5, 7X5, 8XX, GPSMAP 6X0 and Zumo 660 series ONLY. If your 750 is acting up then you need to get it fixed or replaced.

Secondly

The problem lies with the fact at as of June 21 at 00:00 the GPS constellation changed the way it reports time. This change was announced ten years ahead of the implementation, so there was no excuse for Garmin not having qualified the product under the new schema.

Third

Garmin is truly at fault because they switched from Sirf to MTC for these products to save money. They are under tremendous pressure to deliver new products at ever lower prices (anyone hear about the new Indian laptop with 2 gigs of RAM that will retail for US$10?).

To make matters more complicated, the product life cycles are getting very short, so they don't have the time to properly test product, assuming that they wanted to.

The Zumo 660 is a piece of crap. Filled with bugs, I'd wager that no one who rides a DS or touring machine had any influence in specifying or testing the device.

I'm also reasonably certain that Garmin dumped a buggy product on the market because riding season was upon them and they would lose market share to TomTom who also had a new product with a few interesting features that Garmin cannot provide for some reason. So they they stuck the poor consumer with a VERY expensive piece of trash.

Fourth

The issue with the chipset is NOT resolved, but Garmin has performed a work-around and the code that bricked the units is supposedly fixed.

That Garmin hasn't been very effective at notifying people of the need to update their devices is another interesting question;

After all, they have my e-mail address. They have the serial numbers and presumably know the firmware versions for all of my various navigators. How hard would it have been to send out an e-mail to the registered users of the affected units?

I just don't see where Garmin has proactively stepped up to the plate in any way on this one. heck you have to go searchng on their web site to find the stupid announcement,.

I agree with some of your points. However, to be fair, I did receive an email from Garmin on 6/24 at 7:52 PM regarding the mandatory update (755T).

I certainly didn't . . . . but notices about firmware upgrades for units I no longer own show up from time to time.

dilligaff

I too got an email to update, all works fine. I also have a Magellan as a back Up(1470). Not all the Thrills of a Garmin but gets you from A-B and all points between, plus I love the 4.7 Screen. Every one has a wake up call in life, maybe this was Garmins.

if Best Buy pulled them, howcome my coworker was able to get one from a Best Buy in Nashville, TN ?

He traveled all the way from Hawaii on company business to here for training on the bigger jets the airline brought recently.

There never was any proof that BB ordered the units pulled from the shelves.

Stores in my area, and there are about 6 within a half hour drive all have limited stocks of the units. The first store I went to told me they had 2 in stock, one was the demo and they had just sold the other. They did locate a store about 10 minutes away that had 3 in stock. That's where I went.

As I stated in an earlier post, I picked up a new 765T from my local BestBuy Wednesday evening, July 1. I registered it Thursday morning and d/l'd firmware v3.60 even though I think it already had that version loaded. It already had the 2010 maps loaded since the unit was delivered to the store from Garmin earlier in the day. I took it out for a brief spin yesterday, and it works great. Lots more features than my c340, so it will take a while to get used to all of them. Used the serach engine on POI Factory to look up some info about the 765T's operation and was able to find my answers very quickly and easily.

I am very pleased with the unit. An FYI - before I bought the unit, I sent tech support at Garmin an email (or two) about the firmware problems and my concerns about purchasing that model. I got replies within a few hours of each sent email. Garmin's respone, and the posts I read on POI Factory in a couple of threads, gave me the confidence to complete the purchase.

Thanks.

Who care who ordered them pulled. It would be of more interest if Garmin would place stickers on the units to indicate if they were updated to X.XX firmware/maps/etc.

My decision to hold on to my 760 (with has been flawless since the last update) still stands. I am very disappointed with the newer models that Garmin is releasing with less features and the inability to display the upcoming street name due to an infringement settlement. I have decided to wait an see what comes out in a year or so and/or consider another mfr/brand.

This thread might explain why Costco didn't have any Garmin units on their website yesterday. I thought it was strange at the time. I just checked again and the only nuvi on the site is the 275T.

So that's the reason Garmin stopped displaying the upcoming street names in the text bar.

Do you have any more information regarding this?

metricman - Well said....

My best buy has pulled them all off

ANYONE can patent ANYTHING. So what if it infringes?

A patent that claims that displaying the name of upcoming streets is some sort of 'invention' is a crock and can EASILY be defeated in a court of law because it fails THE most important test;

"Is it obvious to someone skilled in the art?"

And, if nothing else is, displaying the names of upcoming streets is as obvious as it gets.

Research In Motion (RIM, the manufacturers of the Blackberry) settled for almost $670 million dollars for patent infringement and each and every one of those patents was eventually struck down - and some of them were really interesting.

In any case can't find any press on the web to support the claim . . .

However, if it turns out that Garmin has caved on this issue and will not challenge this most basic functionality and won't include the feature in future, then I for one will no longer be buying any more navigators with Garmin's name on them.

So, what brand WILL I be buying from now on?