Your opinion is needed (damaged cameras)

I think your instincts are correct, include them all.

That's my two cents.
Cheryl

make that 4 cents...

Most definately keep them in the POI file. With the profit these cameras generate I know that they will be operational as soon as possible.

I agree with everyone else, having all of them listed (working or not) is great. Even if they aren't working today they could be tomorrow. As the saying goes....It's better to error on the side of caution.

Yeah, leave 'em in.

Better be safe knowing where the red light cams are whether working or not.

Another vote for keeping them in.

Richard

My personal two cents worth is the proverbial, 'better safe that sorrow'. I say, yes,include them.

Keep them all on the list. Having worked for the State of MA. for many years, they will get fix, when they realize that they have to find more money they will fix them. 7/1/08 is the start of the new budget year, plenty of extra money around right now.

We should all be driving like ALL lights are redlight cams. That way nobody would need this POI and WE would be a lot safer. But yes keep all listed, in fact maybe list all redlights, MMMnnn

I completely agree with everyone else on here, keep the temporarily non functional cameras on the list.

Keep them all listed.

I agree with everyone else here . . . leave 'em in.

Yes, include them all. In my area there are redlight camera intersections that will have the camera housings but no working cameras. There isn't any way of knowing what intersections have "active cameras" or not. Better safe than sorry.

IMHO, inoperable cameras should not be included. They will just clutter up the file. At the time the cameras are fixed they should be added to the file.

P.S. - nah, just joking. I figured you needed at least one dissenting opinion. I too agree that all cameras (working, nonworking, empty housings) should be included.

Better to be safe than sorry. Keep them in.

Ok, I guess that settles that, thanks everyone that chimed in. I will work on adding the locations back in next week.

Another huge thanks go out to Islandersb who has been the member helping me out in this area.

Miss POI

Buuu buuuu buuut, I never got to chime in on the issue? Ah well, I WOULD HAVE voted with everyone else anyway! (LOL)

Since everyone seems to be in the "better safe than sorry" bucket, why not just treat EVERY red-light as having a camera, and obey the signal. We'll ALL be safer, and will use up less internet band-width downloading this ever-changing file

Yes, you betcha, si, dah, ja, oui. Please keep them in! They will get fixed, probably sooner rather than later.

I would keep them for the points already made and for the admin nightmare that this would create.

I would keep them because who is going to know when they are turned back on? Once the flash goes off? To late...

Squatch

No harm is done by keeping the locations with damaged cameras. I vote to keep the locations listed.

gwr50

No harm is done by keeping the locations with damaged cameras. I vote to keep the locations listed.

gwr50

No harm is done by keeping the locations with damaged cameras. I vote to keep the locations listed.

gwr50

No harm is done by keeping the locations with damaged cameras. I vote to keep the locations listed.

gwr50

Wow! were comments late.... Please delete them, all of them...... all 6 of them

gwr50

keep em in

Keep them all

Miss POI and the whole gang:

WOW! How's that for an overwhelming response? Perhaps my main reason for asking you to include all NYC locations irrespective whether working, missing, damaged or vandalized is that by NYC ordinance, the Five Boroughs that make up NYC are permitted to have only a total of 125 working cameras throughout the entire city, optimum word being working. As you know I have personally verified and sent you way more than 125 locations. You see using NYC Department of Transportation/bureaucratic logic, what is working today may not be working tomorrow and visa versa. Mostly the manner in which the working cameras are put into service is with a bait and switch mentality. The folks that run the NYCDOT truly are a pack of mutts. While other states have capitulated to Freedom of Information Law requests to reveal the locations of their red light cameras, NYC has STEADFASTLY REFUSED to do such. As you may know (now you do) I received my list from them (after having my F.O.I.L. request and F.O.I.L. administrative appeal denied) because I took them to court. Once in court I asked why is the NYCDOT allowed to utilize my tax dollars to implement and maintain this red light camera program yet think they are exempt from having to publicly account for how they are spending their share of my tax dollars? Laughing the judge asked the city attorney "Is it realistic to assume that if he (the judge) were to get a summons because his car was photographed going through a red light camera location that he (the judge) would not share this location with his family and friends who would then pass it along to people they knew? Eventually wouldn't all the locations be revealed by word of mouth?" The city attorney's only argument was In the interest of safety the locations should remain a secret...blah...blah...blah. My answer to that (with pictures) was "why has the NYCDOT posted 'Red Light Camera Corridor' signs all over the Bronx, but in no other borough? Are we to assume that these locations must remain a secret in all the boroughs of NYC EXCEPT the Bronx?" The judge complimented my efforts and ordered the NYCDOT to turn over the entire list. In a concession to the NYCDOT he did not compel them to release to me which camera locations are active and which ones are not. So since I have the list of EVERY NYC based red light traffic camera why not include every one so they can all be loaded into our GPS in the event they turn others on?

To make an enormously long story simply long I have asked Miss POI to include EVERY NYC location whether working or not so in the event the city gets more camera locations approved by the state and city council they will surely spring into action and fix and/or turn on these currently dead or damaged locations. These cameras have been a cash cow for NYC and if Mayor Michael "Can't you see the City needs the money" Bloomberg has his way all of these locations will one day be up and running. Best that we have them in our GPS devices now and get the jump on them for a change.

I want to thank Miss POI for her diligent efforts and for originally trusting me to compare her list to my master list. We have spent many many hours and I have utilized many gallons of that precious liquid called gasoline getting this NYC list photographed and verified so that all our fellow POI brothers and sisters stay on the cutting edge. Chalk one up for the little guy and gal.

Regards all except the Bozos at the NYCDOT,

John

Islandersb

because the cameras are more profit then safety. You can LEGALLY stop too far behind the line, and still get a ticket. Better safe than sorry.

Please keep the files. It's better to be alerted for a non-working camera than to get a ticket

Hey Dr.
If you don't mind since your not going to waste your bandwith, let me waste it for you. I'll download it twice.! I want to be twice as safe.

Bob

Looks like we all need the poi except you!

...both of us just wasted bandwidth responding off-topic to each other

And my original response was more tongue-in-cheek than anything. I used to work in the traffic control industry, and these ARE more about $$$ than safety.

Hope everyone is safe this holiday weekend, with or without the red-light download

If you're stopped LEGALLY behind the line, I doubt the officer is going to waste time writing a ticket that you would easily get out of

...as is. No harm, no foul!

Miss POI,
With a red light ticket in Calif. costing $381 plus the cost of going to traffic school added to that, I would rather have ALL intersections listed.
I have been on vacation in Ventura, CA this month and have noticed MANY red light cameras in operation. I may have tripped one off, even though I was already in the intersection before the light turned yellow. It will be interesting to see if I have a ticket when I return home in a few days.
Also, my driving habits have changed, for the worse,due to the cameras. I now speed up just before I enter an intersection so that I will not get caught again. Many of the cameras now are set to pick up those who do not come to a complete stop before making a right hand turn. At $381 each that comes up to serious money for the local government.
Hope this helps. (Sorry for the long answer).
JeffSh

In British Columbia we have about 120 camera sites, but we only have 30 cameras which are rotated through the various sites. An official for the public auto insurance company ICBC, Doug McClelland, said: "Even when there's no camera in the box, the flash still goes off if someone runs the light and the device gathers information on the number of violations. That helps police determine where the problem is greatest."

This practice occurs in other jurisdictions as well. In Calgary, Alberta, 36 cameras are used for 44 locations.

thanks

Keep them all. Drivers need to be onguard.

Henry

I agree with everyone else here . . . leave 'em in.

Include them all....better safe than sorry...Im in NY and would rather be alerted to a broken cam

i would list all broken or cameras not working also. because they will probably be fixed . thanks glenn

While I haven't used the file, I would still agree that it's better to be safe than sorry for those that do use it.

I, too, have seen one intersection in the northwest suburbs that have the red-light camera "photo enforced" signs, two from each direction, and one in each direction in the actual intersection.

Then, I take a good look around - I see no camera's anywhere. Either they're now placing them a half block away, or spending all the money on signs to make everyone "think" there are camera's there.

have to agree. all cameras should be listed and we should drive carefully in any event

All of the camera locations have now been reinstalled into the file.

Thanks for you support in this issue.

Miss POI

...good job! thank you!

Please leave them in.
Thank you for asking!