Ran the yellow got a ticket for running the red

Short answer, you don't. If you are in the intersection on a yellow, by law that is illegal in most jurisdictions.. yellow means prepare to stop.
You can try to fight it, but you'll have a better chance at winning the lottery to be honest.

BlayzaJ: Did you not receive a picture of your vehicle short of the white stripe limit line with the stoplight already displaying red?

To be violation in Dallas your vehicle must not have crossed the white limit line (e.g. into the intersection) when the stoplight has already turned red.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Johnny Coffee: It makes no sense to be in violation just because your vehicle is in the intersection when the stoplight is showing yellow. Think about it - you can enter into the intersection under a green light, but then the stoplight can turn yellow one foot after your vehicle crossed the intersection limit line. It is humanly impossible to prevent being in the intersection with a yellow light...because you cannot predict when a stoplight will turn yellow...

'It's always legal to drive safely through an intersection when the light is green or yellow. In fact, in most states, as long as the front of your vehicle entered the intersection (passed the crosswalk or limit line) before the light turned red, you haven't broken the stoplight law.

A steady yellow light signals that the light will turn red soon. So, you must either come to a safe stop before the crosswalk, or, if you can't stop safely, proceed with caution through the intersection before the light turns red.'

Are you saying you have never been in an intersection when the light turn yellow? Or you've never entered an intersection and a fraction of a second later the light turns yellow? So you know precisely when the green light will turn to yellow? You must be a psychic. I wish I had that gift.

"Short answer, you don't. If you are in the intersection on a yellow, by law that is illegal in most jurisdictions.. yellow means prepare to stop.
You can try to fight it, but you'll have a better chance at winning the lottery to be honest."

Not sure of your extrapolation of figuring I have psychic ability with my comment..but...

I never indicated that I have never been in an intersection when the light had turned yellow iether while making a left turn or otherwise, but according to the the laws here.. for all intents and purposes it is illegal according to our rules and regs in Manitoba..but it definitely is a grey zone as they say it's illegal to do so but also say if caught in the intersection to proceed with caution..a left turn I can understand but being behind someone and trying to get through before the red is another issue all together..at that point you should not have entered the intersection.
Right or wrong, if you are in the intersection when you shouldn't be and you see "the flash".. you ain't gonna win the argument.

there are clues that the light is about to change and one DOES NOT have to be a psychic as has been suggested by someone.

For example the pedestrian light will start flashing before the light even turns yellow. So if you see the flashing pedestrian light be or get prepared to stop. But where I live a yellow light seems to mean "HAMMER" the accelerator!!!

"Yellow traffic control light or arrow at intersection
88(5) When a yellow or amber traffic control light or arrow is being shown at an intersection by a traffic control signal following or accompanying a green traffic control light,

(a) the driver of a vehicle at or approaching the intersection and facing the light or arrow shall not enter the intersection, unless he can leave it before a red traffic control light or such other signal as next follows, begins to be shown; and ...."

http://web2.gov.mb.ca/laws/statutes/ccsm/h060e.php

So basically the law in your area says you can be in the intersection on a yellow as long as you can clear the intersection before the red signal lights.

Here in Pennsylvania they have to show you at least two photo's of your vehicle, one crossing the stop line on a red signal, and one of your vehicle passing through the intersection.

The second photo is important, because you can trip the light by pulling up too far but not proceed through the intersection, the only time a violation is issued is for proceeding through on a red, pulling up too far is not a violation.

I understand what it says on paper, but I've known numerous people to be caught in an intersection iether by poor choice or inattentiveness and getting dinged by a flash from a camera or flash from a cops lights.
I personally play it safe and never run an amber and try my hardest not to put myself in a situation where I will be caught in the middle of an intersection.. excluding completing a left turn.
Trying to fight a ticket like this in court will cost you more than the ticket is worth.

Yes, reality and written law can be very different, but I was responding to your

which isn't exactly true. Being in the intersection on a red is illegal.

I should have been more specific.. generally if you are in an intersection on an amber, great likley hood of you being there as the light turns red.

If you are going the speed limit and one nanosecond after your vehicle's front-end crosses the limit line the light turns yellow - you ARE in the intersection on a yellow! How can that (being in the intersection on a yellow light) possibly be in violation of the law?

Are all people where you live expected to be psychic and know exactly when a stoplight will turn from green to yellow, which by the way happens at the speed-of-light?

Amazing stuff!

I run the intersection on yellow all the time (making sure to look for people turning left coming from the other direction). I have never had a problem with it in my entire life.

It was stated, in part, by "Sober Byker"...

Actually, that statement, in and by itself, is incorrect. There are three everyday driving situations (among others) that happen on a daily basis nationwide that a driver might find themselves being in when the light turns red... and I'm not using the yellow turning to red as one approaches the intersection.

1.) You're in left turning lane, having entered intersection on green. Light turns red while you wait for oncoming traffic to clear for you to make your left turn.

2.) You've entered intersection on green in right lane heading straight ahead. There are a number of vehicles ahead of you, when they stop (for whatever reason)... which now places you in intersection when light turns red.

3.) There are many more situations, like the above, that might place you in the intersection when the light turns red. As I said in the title of my post...

"Circumstances Dictate Legal/Illegal".

(Former) Nuvi1300WTGPS... (Now) Nuvi52LMGPS

I believe there are some jurisdictions where being in any part of the intersection when the light turn red is a violation. Sometimes called “don’t block the box”. The problem is in heavy congestion drivers knowingly enter the intersection, even with a green light, but are unable to exit because of stopped traffic. When the light changes, they then block cross traffic. In an effort to prevent expanding gridlock, drivers who “block the box” can be ticketed.

I drive in New York City, the home of "block the box." Drivers can be ticketed for blocking the box, but only at certain intersections specially marked with cross-hatching. These are only in the "grid lock" areas.

The ticket is for blocking the intersection, not for a red light violation.

dobs108

this discussion firstly has nothing to do with any GPS related subject and secondly the OP has only apparently got onto this forum solely to complain about a ticket.
My 0.02

This is the Ticket Cameras forum and the OP may have received a ticket from a camera. GPSs can be used to alert when approaching a ticket camera.

Also, we talk about many subjects other than GPS. See the Welcome/Open Talk forum.

dobs108

Yes in a more specific sense you point out some reasons for being in the red and I have experienced them all, however the context of my statement was a general statement to counter that being in the intersection while the light is yellow is illegal pointing out the way the Manitoba law is written.

It's useless to fight the ticket 99% you don't win.

armchair quarterbacks in one thread. Simply go to court, and tell the truth. Gee whiz my dad and brother both got summonses in Boston, imho a very mean place, and both summonses were dismissed.

It is not a violation to enter an intersection on yellow. If this were the case, nobody would ever be able to complete a turn in certain intersections.

Just my observation, there seem to be some who like to argue but at the same time they are not helpful. Just very pessimistic and unfactual. My .02

I have received one and along with still pics I was given a link to watch the video of me going through the intersection. They must have it because usually an officer or someone reviews each one to verify the infraction. The video should show pretty clearly whether you're guilty or not.

I have see severals video and on the news too,that some people have been able to fight and won in court,most of the time when the picture or the video does not show the driver of the vehicle during the infraction.

It would be nice if they can add a more time DELAY on Yellow

PA law states the cameras are not allowed to take front shots, our plates are on the rear only, the ticket goes to the registered owner of the vehicle, the only defense is being able to prove you were not driving the car at the time, provided that the photos they have clearly show a violation.

And I quote "I drove thru a yellow light and got cited for running a red light....how do I fight this ticket".

No where does it state he got the ticket from a red light camera. As far as we know it was an actual, live person that cited him/her.

True, but it's posted in the "ticket camera" forum so ....

I'd like the OP to elaborate on his post..but it appears that it's likely a one off.

I detest automated law. It can sometimes be horribly wrong with no way to fight it. Traffic laws can be idiotic.

I once got a ticket on a rental car for illegal parking in Beverly Hills. I was not in Beverly Hills. I had spent the day at UC Northridge The ticket had my name but the car was not the one I rented. There was NO way to fight the ticket unless I went to Beverly Hills traffic court which was a good 8 hour drive from where I live. A total ripoff.

It is always legal to drive safely through an intersection when the light is green or yellow. In fact, in most states, as long as the front of your vehicle entered the intersection (passed the crosswalk or limit line) before the light turned red, you haven't broken the stoplight law.

Actually, in a few states it may be a violation to enter an intersection on a steady yellow signal if you could have stopped safely. To quote from Oregon law: (https://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/811.260) "(5) Steady circular yellow signal. A driver facing a steady circular yellow signal light is thereby warned that the related right of way is being terminated and that a red or flashing red light will be shown immediately. A driver facing the light shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, shall stop before entering the marked crosswalk on the near side of the intersection, or if there is no marked crosswalk, then before entering the intersection. If a driver cannot stop in safety, the driver may drive cautiously through the intersection."

From DOT web site (https://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/publications/fhwahop08024/chapter5....) Section 5.3.2: "The duration of the yellow change interval is typically based upon driver perception-reaction time, plus the distance needed to safely stop or to travel safely through the intersection.
A state’s Uniform Vehicle Code directly affects yellow change interval timing, as it determines whether a permissive or restrictive yellow law is in place.
•Permissive Yellow Law: A driver can enter the intersection during the entire yellow interval and be in the intersection during the red indication as long as the vehicle entered the intersection during the yellow interval. Under permissive yellow law, an all-red clearance interval must exist as a timing parameter to ensure safe right-of-way transfer at an intersection. This rule is consistent with paragraph 11-202 of the Uniform Vehicle Code (9).
• Restrictive Yellow Law: There are two variations of this law (10). In one variation, a vehicle may not enter an intersection when the indication is yellow unless the vehicle can clear the intersection by the end of yellow. This implies that the yellow duration should be sufficiently long as to allow drivers the time needed to clear the intersection if they determine that it is not possible to safely stop. In the other variation, a vehicle may not enter an intersection unless it is impossible or unsafe to stop. With restrictive yellow law, the presence of an all-red interval is optional and good engineering judgment should be applied."

Google is your friend, do a search on permissive yellow and restrictive yellow.
Mark

In some states, there are laws that restrict the entrance into an intersection if you can't clear the intersection. So, in that case, I can imagine even if you entered into an intersection, but didn't clear it on a green and your vehicle is stuck in the intersection as a red light is created, when someone else traverses the sensors, you could be sited for running a red light even though it was green when you entered...

In Phila., PA they have such a law, called "Don't block the box", the box being the intersection. The sign looks like this:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5205/29864466986_772643c102_b....

enforcement, I kind of get it, from having spent time in KY this year. There's simply no need, everyone is courteous and follows the law. It doesn't seem to be the case here in Phila. at least.

I was at Belmont and Concourse at a red light today (it's an every day occurrence as actors are pretty sly). A dark colored Chevy Impala with tinted windshield and side glass and rear glass blows through at at least 50 mph. Wouldn't you know (the actor did as well as the rest of us) that the RLC is one block south, and not here? Nothing is going to change the behavior short of removing the driver from driving. I guess if we go down the path of making sure there's no automated enforcement, the rest of the population needs to be aware of their surroundings, like it was in 1940.

nobody seems to understand (we all took the same driving test didn't we?) is stop here on red. I find a lot of people think they cannot turn right on red when they see it. And it's simply dumbfounding how many people will not take a left on red when legal.

It's honestly dumbfounding the amount of people that simply should not be behind the wheel, being taught to drive by these "ACME driving schools" that themselves haven't a clue of the rules of the road,let alone teaching others.
When I (we) all took our tests, there was a thing called common sense...that unfortunately is now on the endangered species list.

There is no requirement to turn right (or left) on Red, so no worries if your policy is not to. The local transit authority has a strict policy of no turns on red, so all buses will not turn until green. Anyone is welcome to following this policy so do not let folks pressure you into turning on a Red.

And no, we did not all take the same driving test. Each state has its own test (and laws vary). Most states do not require you to take a new test upon moving into the state. And the test changes over time, so if you took a driving test 10+ years ago, you would likely find different laws and questions tested today. Finally, if you obtained your license elsewhere (e.g. France) and moved to a state that has reciprocity with that nation (e.g. Pennsylvania), you would not need to take a test in the U.S. at all. BTW: Many nations such as France do not allow turns on Red at any time.

Drive safe!

There certainly is a way to fight the ticket without going to Beverly Hills traffic court. You can contest in the mail or online. See: http://www.beverlyhills.org/citygovernment/parkingservices/c...

An attorney can also be present in your place, but I would start with the online or US mail option.

Entering an intersection without a clear way ahead to exit the intersection is a blocking the intersection/box violation in many states and cities (hopefully everywhere someday). This is what leads to gridlock, because then the intersecting street cannot move on their green because of the selfish folks who are blocking the intersection.

reminds me of when I did not want to turn right on red, when the sign said no turn on red. The woman behind me held her hand down on her horn, it was some sort of Escalade or something and had a very loud aggressive but pleasant sounding horn (maybe it had more than two tones). I thought probably in my dad's days she wouldn't be doing that.

interesting perspective that would effectively cripple places like NYC, and Atlanta once amazon has its 2nd hq there.

In a practical sense, there can be 0-1 cars that make it through a cycle of a green. Man what a bizarre way to look at it.

Been there, done that. Their proof is 2 photos, one showing that the light is red and you are NOT in the intersection, and one showing the light is red and you ARE in the intersection.
If they do not have both of those, you did not run the red light.
Being in the intersection means, the last time I read it, that your bumper has crossed over the white line. You need to read your local statute to verify this. If either one shows a yellow, or they do not have the first one, you're not guilty.

While you are reading, verify that YELLOW means to come to a stop and wait for the light to cycle back to green before proceeding, UNLESS IT IS UNSAFE TO DO SO. You are the driver and the only one who can make the decision whether it is safe to stop or not.

I was stopped by an officer once, and went to court with that defense. Not guilty. It pays to read the statute.
I was caught by a camera, clearly not in the intersection and the light red, then in the intersection and the light red. Guilty as charged. I missed it by thhhaat much.

Cripple? No, blocking intersections cripple traffic flow. Police in NYC give tickets ALL THE TIME for folks who enter intersections without a clear way to exit (usually due to stopped traffic ahead). This causes gridlock when the intersecting street now with a Green is blocked from movement by the selfish folks still in the intersection after their light turned red, because there was never enough room to get through.