Navigation App without Data Plan?

Google

Navfree, Sygic, Copilot, and Navigon are similar to traditional GPS receivers in having maps for the entire country.

Google, if I recall correctly, only downloads tiles along the route, and you can only deviate so far from the route before you run out of map.

You could even look into TomTom For Android.

True Google is not practical for a long trip but it can be done if you stop every couple hours to get the next chunk.

I use it around town by catching to use off line a large square area that covers all my area (4 counties 87mb) almost from Clearwater to Orlando FL and down to Sarasota. (Google map lets you draw the square and save it for future use)

Google is most useful around town rather than cross country.

This past winter we went on a cruise to the Southern Caribbean. I downloaded and cached maps for each of the destination stops that we would be visiting.

Worked fine.

I have both the TomTom Android app and the CoPilot Android app installed on my phone. Both use a map of the entire US that I downloaded through a WiFi connection with no impact on the phone account's data usage. When map updates are issued, I also download those via WiFi. Accordingly, there is no data plan expense associated with the mapping and routing functions of those apps.

As it happens, I do use a bit of my data plan for the optional Traffic information, but that was by my choice, and is not automatic. The amount of data transferred for the traffic info is well within my monthly quota, so there is no actual additional payment to the phone company as a consequence.

With best wishes,
- Tom -

Google's not hateful, you can save 6 fairly large wi-fi tile downloads, but I'd be a bigger fan if it were 10 or more. Or if you could save the tiles to switch them in & out on the fly.

Still pretty useful for quite a few people, I think.

I don't have anything with android or apps so I don't know anything about them.

I am looking at the Ipad mini. From reading the above post it looks like I could download apps and use it as a gps, if it has gps, and have no data. Is this correct?

@mgarledge

The WiFi Mini iPad doesn't have GPS built in.
The Mini iPad with data plan does have a GPS.

What's this about downloading Google tiles?
I saved an offline map and when I use it and try to use directions I get a "cannot complete action without a data connection" notification.
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks.

As the WiFi only mini doesn't have a GPS receiver, you would need to purchase an external GPS receiver for the unit.As of right now, I don't think anyone makes one that connects directly through the interface connector. You can get wireless units, but those are around $200. That brings the cost of the lowest priced unit to over $500.

On the other side of the coin there are many Android tablets, both 7 inch and 10 inch that have GPS built-in for less than the base cost of the Apple. A Nexus 7 has a more brilliant, higher resolution display and retails near $200. It also has GPS built-in. The Kindle Fire HD has the most brilliant display, but lacks GPS.

I will congratulate you on deciding what you want as an application before running out and buying something that would not be well suited. Continue looking and decide what features you want and what you consider as mandatory, then narrow the field before making a selection.

Thanks for the information. I want a tablet with gps, wifi, and can add a data plan later on if I want to. Don't know much about them but am learning. Will keep researching.
Thanks again.

If I get a mini ipad with data plan but don't buy the data plan does it also have wifi, or is it just whatever you get with a data plan?

If you buy the Mini WiFi only you can't add data later, if you want one with built in GPS then one with data plan activated has to be purchased.

I too waited for the Mini iPad to come out, need to buy a tablet for Christmas to give my wife, after comparing it to the Nexus 7 I already own it is a no brainer she will be getting another Nexus 7, for the money and specs the iPad can't touch the Nexus 7, 32gig for $249

External devices can be had for less than the $200 referenced above...

The Garmin GLO is $99... Bad Elf Pro ranges from $99 to $179... if one already has a wifi only device that does not have a GPSr, this is a reasonable, viable option to consider if one is considering replacing their existing GPSr.

I use my wifi iPad3 with a BadElf GPSr that plugs into the charging port... and with the Navigon app, I have a set-up that is comparable in performance to my Nuvi765t. I already had the iPad... this is giving me just that much more use of it.

iPad Mini WiFi only NO GPS
16gb 1024x768 (163ppi)
Dual Core Processor $329
Navigon USA $50
Garmin GLO $99 (added GPSr external equipment)

Total: $478

Nexus 7 WiFi only with internal GPS
16gb 1280x800 (216ppi)
Quad Core Processor $199 (twice as fast)
Navigon USA $50

Total $ 249

You can almost buy two Nexus 7 with Navigon for the price of one iPad Mini

That is a succinct way to put it in perspective.

I use an ASUS 10" Tablet running Android ICS, and the Google Maps download I have (v 6.14.1) will let you "Make Available Offline" up to 6 55mi by 55mi map areas. You draw a box on the area and it downloads and stores on the device. My tablet is Wi-Fi only (no phone) but I would guess that it should work on a phone..

Seems to me that option started 2 map upgrades ago?

EDIT- OK, I just tried navigation without Wi-Fi... no go. Therein lies the rub. Map tiles save, but to get navigation directions you need to be online with the Navigation beta add-on, it seems. Once you have the directions you can go offline but you won't be able to pick a new route.

So, if turn by turn navigation is what you are after then Google Navigation for Maps just isn't there yet. For me though, if it shows my position and has map details without a data connection (which it does), I'm usually good.

Here's the Google link about it:
http://support.google.com/gmm/bin/topic.py?hl=en&topic=16172...

Goto Advanced Features > then Data Connection Loss

http://www.thriveforums.org/forum/toshiba-thrive-apps/12438-...

09-23-2012

After updating to the current version (6.12.0), and caching the local 75-mile square area, I tried google nav again today (on the same route I had tried before). The first time I went off route, it kept trying to get me back to the pre-planned route for a very long time, then it eventually just displayed a "Follow the Route" message (and another notice at the bottom about not having a data connection). Bear in mind that the way I actually went was not some way-out-of-the-way adventure, it was actually the best way to get to the destination (only google did not figure that out ahead of time). Eventually I came back to the same interstate highway as on the original pre-panned route, and google nav resumed the guidance. At the "first" exit where the pre-planned route expected me to exit (but I didn't want to because of traffic and a red-light camera there), I kept heading down the interstate toward the "next" exit. Last time, told me to turn off the interstate at a point where there is no exit (I now realize that although the low quality non-cached display showed me on the interstate, google nav didn't "know" I was on the interstate, and the reason it told me to turn was because it "thought" I was on the nearby outer road, which is where the pre-planned route would have taken me (if I had followed it, and turned at the "first" exit). But this time google nav recalculated the route, and resumed providing navigation instructions. Overall, the quality of the voice annunciations is very good, with very clear, easy to understand pronunciation. That's the good news. Unfortunately there is also some bad news. In my test route, Google nav almost never announced any street names in the outer-suburban area I was driving in, even though the street name did show up visually at the top of the screen most of the time. It did announce street names for the smaller streets closer to my starting point, inside a subdivision that is closer to the metro area, but once I got a bit farther out, it stopped 'saying' street names. It also usually announced "turn now" way too early (and remember, it doesn't say which street to turn on), and it kept on announcing "turn now" for up to about an eighth of a mile. This becomes not only very annoying, but also could be very confusing, especially when two turns follow in quick sequence.

So, even with the latest version of the map caching working as it is apparently supposed to do, my overall assessment remains the same: google nav is nearly useless without a continuous data connection, and based on the quality of the directions I was getting, I'm not sure it's really that useful even with a continuous data connection

The latest version is 6.14.1, and for sure Google maps isn't going to replace my Garmin 765 for voice navigation, but I started travelling with a paper map and my wife's voice navigation. Everything depends on how you roll, but at least now with Google my wife knows which road we're on exactly & in real time. And we both can see the display.

Useful is a relative statement, don't you think?

Nothing wrong just how it works if you do not have a data plan.

You can view the maps and it will track your location on the saved map areas but in order to set a route and get turn by turn you have to have a wifi connection or data plan when you initiate the route guidance.

I have a Samsung 5" Player with built in GPS and google maps work fine as long as I have a wifi available when I start the route I want to take and gives all the normal map views and turn by turn instructions for the entire route I set.

With the right app, you can have full turn by turn without need for any data connection whatsoever.

FWIW, I have extensively tested every mapping & nav app out there, and most of the latest PNDs too. Anyone who tests google nav thoroughly will find the same flaws I noted in my post above (not that subsequent posters read what I noted). Those who don't are using it only for a short trip in a metro area, and/or aren't making any effort to find where google nav goes of course (pun intended).

My posts detailing the flaws starts about here: http://www.thriveforums.org/forum/toshiba-thrive-apps/12438-... in the (probably unlikely) event that anyone wants to know more (vs. being too busy thinking about what they are going to say next).

FWIW, the Mapquest nav app works about the same as google nav, but doesn't require map tile caching the way google nav does. So just from that standpoint, Mapquest is easier to use than google nav, and it has a better interface too. Mapquest also exports for nav units better and in fewer steps than google nav, though it does not support as many as google. Compare using Google maps for .GPX export vs Mapquest and you'll quickly see what I mean.

Mapquest just stops giving directions once you go off route, whereas google nav (with a cached map tile) will reroute but only if you are still very close to the original route.

All of the above assume no data connection while navigating.

If you want useful navigation without a data connection, forget google nav and get CoPilot or Navigon. CoPilot is cheaper but has a lot of problems, not the least of which are in its routing and voice directions. Navigon has a lot of other flaws, but it does give better voice directions than CoPilot. One example of an acid test for a nav app is whether it says street names for roads in urban areas that are also highways (because most if not all of the signs in urban areas give the street name, not the highway number). Navigon passes this test; CoPilot does not, and in many cases google nav does not either (many times, even though the street name appears on the display, it does not speak it).

My head is spinning with so much great information.

I need to look at comparing these things now that I have so much great information. The Nexus 7 looks good, will research it. Thanks

I do not have a tablet but am wanting one to carry in my purse for when I leave the Nuvi home for short trips to town. It looks like I need to do a lot of compairing...
Thanks.

If I just want to use it like a paper map will it show my position without any wifi?

Thanks.

I have to read this three times to get this old mind to understand.

Thanks,

Are you saying no data plan and no wifi?

Like I said my head is spinning. I am re reading each post.

Never dealing with one of these I am in the dark and have to read all y'all have said over again.

Thanks so much.

Yes.

It will show your position even if you go off of the pre-planned route, as long as you are within the cached map tile. It will stop giving directions, if you go very far off-route, and put of a notice that says to "follow the route." Google nav needs a data connection to do much in the way of re-routing. But yes, you can do it yourself, as you would with a map.

Actually it will show your position irregardless of whether or not you've cached the map tile, but it won't do much good without also being able to see the roads.

Yes. Whatever tablet you choose, you can install an app that will give a user experience much like stand-alone GPSr - with no additional need for a data plan or wifi signal. and The only need for a wifi signal would be to update the app or its maps.

My advice is to get a Nexus 7. It has one of the better GPS receivers, and doesn't have a lot of other frills you may not need.

IMO, the best "mobile" device is one that can be held easily and securely in ONE hand (allowing you to use the other hand to operate it), yet is physically large enough to make decent use of the resolution (typically about a million pixels). A 10" tablet is practically the same size as an Ultrabook, which can have a lot more functionality (though admittedly, they usually do not have built-in GPS), and it cannot be held "in the palm of your hand" the way a smaller device can, which is more useful if you want to use a tablet as you might use a conventional notepad. Naturally, the usual people (who have to have one of everthing) will argue that a 10" tablet is not the same physical package as a 12" ultrabook (and while strictly speaking that is true, the difference is practically insignificant). They both have to be carried essentially the same way. Backpackable? Yes. Pocketable? No. The Nexus 7 is about the largest device that you could fit into a pants pocket if need be (provided the pants aren't too tight).

So I'd say that narrows it down substantially. For a phone, that means the 5.5" Samsung Galaxy Note 2. For a tablet, that means one of the better 7" tablets, narrow enough for the fingers of one hand to wrap around it. The Nexus 7 is just about the narrowest 7" tablet available. Most women can hold a Nexus 7 that way. Not so the new iPad Mini. A Nexus 7 should fit easily into your purse. No so for a 10" tablet, which you'll have to carry the same way as you might carry an Ultrabook.

The Nexus 7 also has something every single phone and tablet SHOULD have, but most do not: a grippy surface on the back and partway on the sides/edges. It is not as good as the LG Nitro (which IMO is one of the best in this respect), but it sure is a lot better than most others, including all the Samsung phone/tablet models, which have the same slick finish on the edge that nobody would ever put on a $20 power tool, but most seem to favor on much more expensive & fragile phones & tablets (almost like they want you to drop them, huh?).

The price-performance of the Nexus 7 makes the choice even easier. If you think you MIGHT at some point want cellular data connectivity, you can get that in a Nexus 7 for $299, only $50 more than the comparable wi-fi only 32GB model. That is a far lower premium than almost any other device. The Nexus 7 works on T-Mobile's HSPA+ network, and T-Mobile offers much better no-contract data plans than the other cellular carriers. So if you got a HSPA+ Nexus 7, you would get the ability to use cellular data IF and WHEN you need it, for a VERY SMALL up front premium. One good example of how you might use this is by buying a 30-day T-Mobile broadband data access for only $25 to $35 (http://www.t-mobile.com/shop/AddOns/Accessories/AccessoryDet...) just to use when traveling out of your local area, which is when you'd be more likely to need more than wi-fi data access.

It will depend on the app you are running. If it's one of the online ones such as Google or TeleNav, you need to create the route while on line. If it's an off line, stored app like Tom-Tom, Navigon, Co-Pilot or many others, you can bring up a map and display your current position or even create a route to follow.

That is an important point to make note of. Google Nav does require a data connection (wi-fi or otherwise) just to start up. It also requires a GPS fix, and you probably aren't going to get that indoors. So what this often means is that you have leave the comfort of (for example) your hotel room, and go outside to (hopefully) get a GPS fix, while staying within range of the Wi-Fi signal. So, to be clear, just to get Google nav to work requires both a GPS fix and a data connection.

After that happens, it doesn't matter what route is or isn't plotted, it will show the GPS fix location on the map.

But the point is, shenanigans like this are the hallmarks of a not ready for prime time app, and that's one small part of why I said what I did about google nav in my original post, and that others who disagree haven't experienced these limitations.

So I think I need to look at the 7" tablets.
The Nexus7 sounds good.

I am one of these that over studies something but most of the time I end up with what I wanted.
This time it will be THANKS TO ALL of YOU.

Thanks, Mary

If you ultimately decide for the Nexus 7 I recommend spending an extra $50 and get the 32gig for $249, I currently have the Nexus 7 16gig but will be getting my wife the 32gig for Christmas.

BTW a 32gig iPad Mini is $429

Or better yet, as I mentioned in a previous post, spend an extra $50 for the HSPA+ Nexus 7 for $299, just in case you need access to a cellular data network from time to time. That $50 premium is a lot lower than any other competitor.

...and though already mentioned, worth noting again that version has no internal GPS either. It's also too wide for most women to hold comfortably in the palm of one hand, and a tight fit in most pants pockets too.

FYI: http://mashable.com/2012/10/23/ipad-mini-compared/

The Galaxy Tab 2 is a lot slower than the Nexus 7

You can compare processor performance here:
http://browser.primatelabs.com/android-benchmarks
http://browser.primatelabs.com/ios-benchmarks

Selected results:
Nexus 10: 2271
Galaxy Note II: 1950
Nexus 7: 1484
Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 7.0: 777

iPad (4th generation): 1754
iPhone 5: 1566
iPad mini: 746

Another thing to consider: battery replacement:
Nexus 7 Teardown Reveals Battery Is Easy to Replace
http://mashable.com/2012/07/03/nexus-7-teardown/

...while the iPad mini continues the decades-long Apple tradition of making things as difficult and expensive to repair as they possibly can (trust me, I've been down this road many times, Apple has always been this way, almost like they are trying to encourage you to buy a new one once the battery gets weak): http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iPad+Mini+Teardown/11423/1

BTW, here's the "normal" way of opening an iPad to replace the battery: http://guide-images.ifixit.net/igi/4fxfmcVjva3qxKDl.medium

You can get an excellent Dual Electronics XGPS150A Universal Bluetooth GPS for under $100 to use with your Mini or any other blue tooth enabled device..

Is the HSPA to order separate or is it in the Nexus 7?
Thanks

HSPA+ is a cellular networking term that in reality is a "3G" technology that AT&T coopted and marketed as 4G when it really is not.

The Nexus 7 sounds like what I want with all the trimmings. But just looking at these threads and there is Android and ios. Is this the same thing that Windows is to a pc. What is the difference in Android and ios?

So it is build in to the Nexus 7. I just need to make sure and that it saies it will work with a cell phone?

iOS is the Apple operating system and is unique to only Apple products. Android is more open source in that it is more freely available. Android is from Google and is based on Linux, an open source UNIX operating system that runs on a great many computers using processors based on the Intel instruction set. Apple just a few years ago started using Intel processors.

I actually understood that

iOS is derived from OS X, with which it shares the Darwin foundation, and is therefore a Unix operating system. iOS is Apple's mobile version of the OS X operating system used on Apple computers. Apple does not license iOS for installation on non-Apple hardware.

There are three versions of the Nexus 7 available:
16GB internal storage & Wi-Fi $199
32GB internal storage & Wi-Fi $249
32GB internal storage & Wi-Fi & HSPA+ $299

The $299 version has the HSPA+ cellular data connectivity built in to it. The HSPA+ Nexus 7 will work on the HSPA+ data networks of AT&T & T-Mobile (and others), but it is not compatible with AT&T's newest LTE 4G network that is only available in some metro areas (Please note that the terms "4G" and "LTE" are not the same thing; the first 4G networks such as WiWax were not LTE, but the newest ones are LTE, with the difference being that LTE offers the potential for higher speeds than the earlier 4G technologies did). The HSPA+ Nexus 7 also will not work on Sprint or Verizon, which use entirely different technology than AT&T and T-Mobile.

While there is a lot of hoopla and disinformation about 4G LTE, here's the bottom line: unless you REALLY need the highest speed mobile broadband all the time, and plan on spending at least ~$50 per month every month for a contract data plan, you don't need to worry about needing 4G LTE

Some people (especially those who are fixated on superficial technicalities) consider HSPA+ to not be true 4G, but the fact is that it's a lot faster than 3G technologies. You probably don't care what the technology is called, just that it works well enough, and how much it costs (including the monthly cost), right?

While 4G LTE is great to have if you need it, availability is also limited to major metro areas, and probably will be for quite some time to come. HSPA+ is slower than 4G LTE but is available over a far wider area, outside of metro areas, because it's basically piggybacked onto the existing network, whereas 4G LTE required an all-new approach. That's why you see T-Mobile's commercials (girl on motorcycle) claiming they have thousands of 4g cell towers, and Verizon commercials (guy with charts) claiming they have far more 4G LTE than any other carrier. Both ads are true. For quite some time, Verizon has been the leader in offering the fastest data network in the most metro areas - for a price. A certain class of mobile data user needs what Verizon offers. My guess is that is not you.

The only reason I even suggested the $299 HSPA+ Nexus 7 is that $50 premium is a fairly small price to pay to have the capability if you *might* need it from time to time. Some people want (and in some cases actually do need) the latest, fastest, most consistently reliable mobile data networks to get there job done. A lot of others (and you can guess who they are) WANT it because they're addicted to consuming various forms of entertainment and/or otherwise wasting time. My presumption is that probably is not you, right?

References:

Based on AT&T’s advertised speeds:

GPRS (2G): “General Packet Radio Service) is the first level of data service on GSM.”
EDGE (2.5G): “EDGE provides typical download speeds of 70-135 kbps.”
HSPA (3G): “the latest 3G devices provide typical download throughput of 700 kbps to 1.7 Mbps for downloads and 500 kbps to 1.2 Mbps for upload”
HSPA+ (4G): “Technology that enables 4G speeds up to 4x faster than AT&T’s already fast mobile broadband network.”
LTE (4G): “Long Term Evolution. Speeds up to 10x faster than 3G.” AT&T says 4G customers can expect download speeds of between 5 Mbps and 12 Mbps, and upload speeds of between 2 Mbps and 5 Mbps.

ref.: http://www.mobile-broadband-reviews.com/att-4g-speed-2012.ht...

also see: http://www.mobile-broadband-reviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2...
and:
http://www.mobile-broadband-reviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2...

You can learn more about mobile broadband here:
http://www.mobile-broadband-reviews.com
and here:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/253808/3g_and_4g_wireless_spe...

Factor into that where you expect you *might* need to access a cellular data network, considering the ever-growing availability of FREE public Wi-Fi. The more easily you can access FREE public Wi-Fi (usually from the parking lot), the less you probably need to access a cellular data network. You have to decide whether or not you need it, and consider this option to add mobile data access to a Wi-Fi only tablet (and/or a laptop): http://www.netzero.net/
NetZero portable 4G hotspot for $49.98 including 200MB per month data access for a YEAR.

NetZero resells CLEAR WiMax service, but their pricing structure is unique. Keep in mind that the CLEAR WiMax coverage area is far smaller than AT&T/T-Mobile HSPA+ coverage area. Also, I have tested CLEAR WiMax extensively, and I can tell you unequivocally that real-world WiMax performance often falls far short of their claimed performance. WiMax is more affected by obstructions and atmospheric conditions than other mobile data alternatives, so their real world coverage area isn't as good as shown on their maps.

It all depends on what you think you *might* need, but the fact is that you're not going to get a year of mobile broadband (admittedly with a very limited data cap) for less than this. In addition to being useful for the usual reasons net access is useful, something like this would also make google maps/nav more viable, too.

I'm not sure if you are basing this on v6.12 or v6.14, or if on a smart phone or a tablet, but on my ASUS tablet w/G.Maps v6.14 all I need is a wi-fi connection for G.Maps to (very accurately) find my location. I was even a bit shocked once to find that Google accurately plotted my position in a friend's cabin in the PA mountains based only on his wi-fi connection.Once I have plotted driving directions I can then enable my gps hardware to follow the route. I usually have the gps turned off when I'm not using it, for battery life. Google also found my location in a hotel, with wi-fi when gps was turned off.

Even with both wi-fi and gps disabled, I can also open G.Maps and browse the map, albeit with best detail and pois in map tiles I have cached. Plotting my realtime position on the map only requires gps hardware.

G.Nav however will not work without a data connection, at least for the initial plot as you said. I look at G.Maps and G.Nav as two different apps (which they really are even though they are bundled).

Android tablets do have the ability to find an approximate location based just on the Wi-Fi signals. I had this feature turned off on my test devices, because I was testing the functionality as a nav unit, which has to work everywhere, not just where there was a Wi-Fi network I could connect to. When I enabled it, I was surprised that Wi-Fi location managed to fairly accurately fix a position based on a single Wi-Fi connection. So that means that with "Google's [Wi-Fi] location service" enabled, it is possible to use that instead of a GPS fix, in order to plot a new route, without having to take the tablet outside to get a GPS fix.

But the fact remains, it will not do that unless actually connected to a Wi-Fi network, correct? IOW, you cannot get a location from nearby Wi-Fi networks that you are not/cannot log into because they are secured, right? At least, when I just tried it, google maps could not find a location unless I was actually connected to my Wi-Fi network. Without that, even though it could "see" about a dozen other nearby Wi-Fi networks, it was still lost without connecting to one of them.

As for the second section, yes, if you cache a google map tile, you can browse it using google maps. In that respect it's like a limited version of a program like Streets & Trips or Street Atlas.
Google Maps and Google Nav may be two separate programs, but Nav is dependent upon Maps. Google Maps is the trip planning front end for Google Nav. Try using Google Nav without Google Maps installed, and see what happens.