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Very small Mobile cam warning in Tempe. Is this legal?

 

In Tempe, Ive noticed a mobile cam on east bound Curry Rd near Mill Ave.

But the weird thing is, the warning sign was VERY small to notice; unlike the ones I ve seen before which are big (atleast as big as other signs on the road.)

Here he a picture of the sign

Any one knows if it is legal in Tempe to use such a small sign?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/78732145@N00/3458518976/

Small Sign

It doesn't look that small to me. If it is a multiple lane road, cars in the fast lane may not see it (blocked by slow lane traffic). Other than that it looks like fair warning. With practice you will probably be able to spot them from blocks away.

I guess that is why

we need the POI Factory even more to alert us of upcoming problems.

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260, 295W, 1490T,2455LMT

small?

I guess I was expecting a postcard size warning. This looks pretty obvious to me, from the picture anyway.

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Garmin Quest/Quest2/Nuvi660/Nuvi755T

Just the way of the future

A sandwich board or a sidewalk sign, have been working for years for restaurants, bars, pubs and retailers. Why not portable ticket cameras?

Your case is weak to say the least, slow down and stop at traffic lights, then the signs don't matter any way.

Not that I agree with the cameras to start with,I just realize they are indeed here for revenue, not for safety.

So pay up your dues and download the Camera files, and relax!

--
Using Android Based GPS.The above post and my sig reflects my own opinions, expressed for the purpose of informing or inspiring, not commanding. Naturally, you are free to reject or embrace whatever you read.

It is small compared to

It is small compared to other signs that they usually put up around here. It is as small as a "No parking" sign, smaller than speed limit signs.

I posted this just to alert others, since these are mobile cams and so not covered by the poi files.

Not Small but...

Not too concern with the size but looks very cheap. I know we're in a recession but talk about cutting back on spending. Someone can just pick that up and stick it somewhere that can cause some major traffic jams.

a sign is better...

A sign is better than no sign.
However, I agree they should put a bigger sign there so people will reduce speed for better safety.

Is a warning required?

Is there some kind of legal requirement for any warning sign at all?

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Will nuvi 265W, Vista HCX, amateur radio

Don't they have regular

Don't they have regular speed limit signs posted? If so, what is the need for more signs?

photo enforced sign

in our county, there are permanent "photo enforced" below speed limit sign in sections mobile speed camera van may show up.

Speed Camera Sign

Any sign is better than no sign. However, the size and appearance of the sign only reinforces the fact that speed cameras are used primarily for generating municipality funding. Slow down, keep your Redlight/Camera poi downloads up to date, and NEVER run a redlight.

It looks like it may be a

It looks like it may be a temporary sign, and will probably be replaced with a permanent sign in the future.

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NUVI 680, NUVI 5000, MS S&T,

Change to mobile

I read in the AZ Rep online newspaper yesterday, that an employee of the mobile camera company was fatally shot while repairing a site and the towns around Phoenix were suspending mobile operations for the time being.

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Nuvi 750 and 755T

I've seen these signs: They are indeed smaller,,,

,,, compared to the signs that Redflex uses with the DPS and Prescott Valley Police marked vans.

It may be (I do not know) that Tempe uses ATS, and therefore, different, and smaller signs.

Jay

Does anyone

AZCOP wrote:

,,, compared to the signs that Redflex uses with the DPS and Prescott Valley Police marked vans.

It may be (I do not know) that Tempe uses ATS, and therefore, different, and smaller signs.

Jay

Does anyone have any idea what the law says about the signage? Is there a size specified or does it simply state they must post a sign to notify drivers? In Montgomery County MD, the signs are black on white and about 10 inches by 12 inches attached to the bottom of the speed limit sign and only state "Photo Enforced."

And people in AZ are complaining about signs that are more than twice as large and orange to boot?

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ɐ‾nsǝɹ Just one click away from the end of the Internet

No warning signs in PV

I was driving through Paradise Valley a couple of weeks ago on Lincoln Dr and saw one of their photo radar vans with no warning signs at all. It was squeezed way over on the side, the only reason I noticed it was when it flashed one of the vehicles ahead of us. I don't drive through there very often, so I don't know if it's normal for them not to have warning signs.

In Tempe, I've noticed huge yellow diamond shaped signs as well as small No Parking sized warning signs.

Bob

I believe signs not required

in Arizona, anyway.

I'm pretty sure I've read that the signs placed out by the mobile camera operators are a "courtesy" and there is no requirement for them, just as there is no requirement for drivers to be alerted to police officers that are using radar.

The speed limit sign (Black on white for regulatory signs) is all that is rqeuired.

Black on yellow are warning signs for "safety" purposes, so probably the signs are put out to alert drivers to a potentially "unsafe" condition of the van being there?

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Nuvi 2595LMT, Nuvi 1490T, Nuvi 260, GPSMAP 195

No signs here

I haven't seen any signs warning of a camera in Philadelphia or Delaware where I drive. They did have some signs when the cameras were first installed. They don't post signs warning of upcoming speedtraps, so I guess neither do they need to warn of cameras. I guess that's what the POI files are for!

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Brent - 2350LMT, 3790LMT, 3597LMTHD

Link to ARS concerning signage

Here is a link to the Arizona Revised Statue regarding signage for photo radar:

http://www.nophotoenforcement.com/fight-a-ticket/

You can read what is posted and determine from there what you think is proper for posted signs.

Thanks

Thanks Vegasbound.

Good to know that the signage requirement in Az is only for 40 mph & higher

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Nuvi 2595LMT, Nuvi 1490T, Nuvi 260, GPSMAP 195

a little something that might help

be sure to read down to the redight cam signs.

http://www.highwayrobbery.net/redlightcamswarningsignreqs.ht...

--
Using Android Based GPS.The above post and my sig reflects my own opinions, expressed for the purpose of informing or inspiring, not commanding. Naturally, you are free to reject or embrace whatever you read.

California Vehicle Code

BobDee wrote:

be sure to read down to the redight cam signs.

http://www.highwayrobbery.net/redlightcamswarningsignreqs.htm

BobDee,

Your link on red light cams is for the California Vehicle code. I cannot find anything similar in the Arizona Revised Statutes. Here is the link to the ARS chapter regarding Transportation:
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ArizonaRevisedStatutes.asp?Titl..., for anyone who might be interested in researching the signage required at Red Light Enforcement zones in Arizona.

The link might be a great resource to have even if one is not interested in signage because every aspect of motoring in Arizona is addressed here.

DOT/FHWA

Check this out. It was 2004 version of DOT/FHWA Standard Hwy signs. See if you can find "DO NOT DRIVE ON TRACKS" sign.

http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/ser-shs_millennium_eng.htm

Mobile Unit

I don't think he was repairing a site...he was working the camera in a mobile unit which was his last week on the job for the company. The AZ Republic reads....

Investigators said Georgianni was sitting behind the driver's seat doing paperwork when the Suburban pulled up behind his van and somebody fired the shots.

The van was hit five times with large-caliber bullets, according to the report, with three of the five shots grouped in a tight pattern around the driver's side window, near where Georgianni was seated. The shooting prompted both companies that operate photo-enforcement programs in the area to pull the mobile units from highways and roads while they reassess security measures.

--
Judy Lynn Garmin 880T

How about more speed limit signs

I understand the issue of speed control warning signs size, requirements, etc. But what I would like to see are speed limit signs. Some of our AZ freeways have speed limit changes between 55, 65, and 75 every mile or two. Being on a freeway doesn't tell you what the limit is where you are unless you remember what the last sign was.

When it is not the standard speed (65) for one reason or another, I wish there would be a requirement to repeat the signs more often. I don't mind being caught for speeding but not when it is because the speed limit was reduced by ONE sign some distance ago (sometimes obstructed by a truck, or at a point where I had to pay attention to another car follies, etc.)

Often, I see the camera warning sign and think "what's the speed limit right here? I think it is 65, but wasn't there a 55 sign a mile ago?" OK, let's slow down to 55, just in case (at least some cars seem to do that!!!)

Speed limits in Az

Page 38 of the AZ Driver's License Manual states:

The following speed limits must be observed when no limit is posted:

15 mph when approaching a school crossing
25 mph in any business or residential district
55 mph on open highways or city freeways
65 mph on designated open highways
75 mph on rural interstate freeways

http://www.azdot.gov/mvd/documents/CustomerServiceGuide_99-0...

If you drive for several miles and don't see a sign, the speed limit is the maximum for that road type and situation.

Most states are similar.

I think you'll rarely see situations where the speed limit drops without a "Reduced Speed Ahead" sign that precedes it by some distance, but I know that does occur.

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Nuvi 2595LMT, Nuvi 1490T, Nuvi 260, GPSMAP 195

All states, and most cities as well

rocknicehunter wrote:

Page 38 of the AZ Driver's License Manual states:

The following speed limits must be observed when no limit is posted:

15 mph when approaching a school crossing
25 mph in any business or residential district
55 mph on open highways or city freeways
65 mph on designated open highways
75 mph on rural interstate freeways

I think you'll rarely see situations where the speed limit drops without a "Reduced Speed Ahead" sign that precedes it by some distance, but I know that does occur.

Have Prima facie (on first appearance) or basic speed laws

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ɐ‾nsǝɹ Just one click away from the end of the Internet

Sign is on the ground??

varmatheone wrote:

In Tempe, Ive noticed a mobile cam on east bound Curry Rd near Mill Ave.

But the weird thing is, the warning sign was VERY small to notice; unlike the ones I ve seen before which are big (atleast as big as other signs on the road.)

Here he a picture of the sign

Any one knows if it is legal in Tempe to use such a small sign?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/78732145@N00/3458518976/

I thought all traffic signs had to be posted @ a certain height, not just on the ground like a sidewalk sale sign.
There has got to be some written laws on this somewhere.

Not on the 101

rocknicehunter wrote:

Page 38 of the AZ Driver's License Manual states:
....

If you drive for several miles and don't see a sign, the speed limit is the maximum for that road type and situation.
....

You haven't driven on the 101 lately. According to your list it should be 55 (city freeway). But it's 65 most of the time with several zones limited to 55, whether there is construction or not. My issue is that unless someone takes notes next to you (TIC), it is difficult to remember if you're in one of these zones or not as the 55 limit sign is not repeated often in the next several miles.

If cameras are really for safety purpose, a speed limit sign reminding the maximum speed would be even more efficient and avoid the slow down that driver create when they're not sure what the speed is when they spot the camera.

But officer...

How do you know its 65 unless its posted as such?

Posted speeds can be higher or lower. What I put up here is the speed limit if there is nothing posted.

Agreed that its hard to set your speed if you don't remember which is correct, but since you won't get a ticket until you're 11 mph over the speed limit, taking your foot off the gas when you see the cameras should slow you enough to get below this cut off, no?

smile

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Nuvi 2595LMT, Nuvi 1490T, Nuvi 260, GPSMAP 195

I agree the highway speeds

I agree the highway speeds change way too much in Phoenix. They need to add a lot more speed limit signs. I try to go off my GPS for speed limits but heck with them changing several areas lately even my GPS is not correct.

precisely My point

rocknicehunter wrote:

...taking your foot off the gas when you see the cameras should slow you enough to get below this cut off, no?

smile

Precisely my point: Many drivers slow down (sometimes drastically) when a camera is in sight and that is a traffic problem. My thought is that many do so because they don't remember if it is really a 65 not a 55 zone.

Displaying the actual speed limit more often -- and always where the camera is -- would at least allow the drivers going at the correct speed to NOT slow down like bandits "just in case".

see no difference

I do not see any differences on human reaction when seeing speed cameras or a COP with laser gun. BRAKE!!

So, why only blame on speed camera?

Yes to both: Show the limit

abin wrote:

I do not see any differences on human reaction when seeing speed cameras or a COP with laser gun. BRAKE!!

So, why only blame on speed camera?

My point applies to all, cameras and van and cops: I wish they would show/repeat the actual limit to prevent most people from slowing down way to much "just in case".

yes. applies to all

jale wrote:
abin wrote:

I do not see any differences on human reaction when seeing speed cameras or a COP with laser gun. BRAKE!!

So, why only blame on speed camera?

My point applies to all, cameras and van and cops: I wish they would show/repeat the actual limit to prevent most people from slowing down way to much "just in case".

Yes. No difference in camera, van, and cops.

no signs required if speed limit is 40 or less

According to that website, no signs are required by law if posted speed limit is 40 or less.

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