-- "Ceterum autem censeo, Carthaginem esse delendam"
“When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
user of a lidar jammer in the u.k. lost his license...
That's a translation of the headline from Britspeak to colloquial American...
Driver of a speedy vehicle installs LIDAR jammer (Google "BLINDER parking sensor"). Gets nailed anyway. Rather than a (mere) fine, because of the jammer, he lost his license for a year.
Jamming/spoofing simple-minded doppler systems is pretty simple from a countermeasures standpoint. The more important issue, as this bloke learned, is judging the reaction of the folks who figure out that their systems are being jammed or spoofed. They are usually NOT happy!
-- Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
Lidar is very directional, so a portable unit (like a radar detector that sits on your dash or window) would not be very effective against Lidar (laser) as the police are taught to target the license plate first, headlights 2nd, and front of vehicle (hood/windshield) last.
Btw, Laser jammers are not illegal in the US as laser laws are under regulation of a different part of the government, not the FCC.
Btw, Laser jammers are not illegal in the US as laser laws are under regulation of a different part of the government, not the FCC.
While they may not be illegal to possess I'd bet real money that you would be charged with obstruction of justice if a cop operating a speed trap caught you using one - and I'll also bet that the judge would find against you because their use violates 'the spirit of the law' (which, of course is to allow the police to remotely determine how fast you are travelling).
We just had a case here where someone was using his cellphone wedged on his shoulder - now that isn't specifically prohibited, the law says you are not allowed to hold the phone in your hand.
The 'spirit of the law' was what the judge cited in his decision to uphold the charge - he admitted that while it was not technically aginst the law, it ran against 'the spirit'.
On the other hand I find it more than interesting that many people seem to now find it perfectly acceptable to wear earbuds while driving - and from what I can tell, many of them are listening to iPods and similar because they have them in both ears - and the police seem to be ignoring this.
On the other hand I find it more than interesting that many people seem to now find it perfectly acceptable to wear earbuds while driving - and from what I can tell, many of them are listening to iPods and similar because they have them in both ears - and the police seem to be ignoring this.
The response I would have to this issue is if it is a requirement that you be able to hear in your car, why do we issue licenses to deaf people? I have not seen anything in the standard driver education manual that says you cannot be hearing impaired in order to get a license. Sight yes, hearing no. So it does pose an issue as to equal protection. If I can get cited for wearing earmuffs, such that I cannot hear anything, while driving and a person who cannot hear at all does not get cited, then there is a double standard at play.
My late father was quite deaf in his later years and often did not wear his hearing aids while driving. It was impossible to even carry on a conversation in those cases.
Keep in mind that deaf people are presumed to have learned to compensate for their disability in many cases, but people who are not hard of hearing have not.
So while I don't disagree with what you say, but there are statutes that preclude the use of headphones and such.
Keep in mind that deaf people are presumed to have learned to compensate for their disability in many cases, but people who are not hard of hearing have not.
So while I don't disagree with what you say, but there are statutes that preclude the use of headphones and such.
How do you write presumptions into the law bramfrank? Maybe deaf people have learned to compensate for their loss of hearing but they still can't hear a horn, bell, siren or train whistle.
The laws against cell phone use while driving have nothing to do with using one hand to hold the phone. I don't know of any state where it is against the law to drive using only one hand. Those laws are about diverting the driver's attention away from his driving. Listening to the car radio or using a 'hands-free' cell phone would also be against the spirit of the law. That judge should be removed from the bench!
"The laws against cell phone use while driving have nothing to do with using one hand to hold the phone. I don't know of any state where it is against the law to drive using only one hand. Those laws are about diverting the driver's attention away from his driving. Listening to the car radio or using a 'hands-free' cell phone would also be against the spirit of the law. That judge should be removed from the bench!"
Ditto !!
And how about eating while driving? Or what about the 2000 watt boombox amplifiers blasting out at 150dbm? The point with cell phones and/or texting is that it requires, IMHO, much more attention which detracts from attention to driving.
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
Detecting a jam/spoof attempt gets interesting. If you detect a signal (CW or MCW) outside the range gate, that's an indication another transmitter is present. But deducing intent (is it another cop radar, construction equipment, or a jammer?) is a different story.
-- Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
I'm an amateur radio operator (N8BSR). I can legally operate a transmitter in all of the ham bands here in the USofA. Each of the common speed-radar bands have close ham bands. I wonder what would happen if I had a modulated microwave transmitter operating from my car, in a band I'm licensed to use, while going through a speed camera location?
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
Detecting a jam/spoof attempt gets interesting. If you detect a signal (CW or MCW) outside the range gate, that's an indication another transmitter is present. But deducing intent (is it another cop radar, construction equipment, or a jammer?) is a different story.
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
Hey Jack,
Read the exemptions again. Hearing aids are allowed in both ears.
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
Hey Jack,
Read the exemptions again. Hearing aids are allowed in both ears.
Yes but ear buds of an mp3 player aren't allowed. Neither are headphones.
So, people who are deaf can wear hearing aids while driving. They can take out the hearing aids and still drive. But they can't wear a mp3 player's ear buds. Does this make sense?
yes, as hams, we can run 1.5KW on X band, and also on a good chunk of the 2.4 GHz band (think Wi-Fi and Bluetooth). We have close allocations on K and Ka as well, but generating enough power to pop someone's front end gets a lot more expensive.
On the other hand, as my good friend Johnny from the local PD says, "I can always write you up for a busted tail light..."
And as an emergency responder, I want these folks to know we're on their side.
But if you want to do something interesting, there are a lot of good monographs from Artech House ranging from the basics of ECM to more advanced fun and games with Doppler systems.
-- Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
I'm not exactly following you here.
Lidar operates via light waves in the Infrared range. Other types of speed measurement devices (radar in the X, K and Ka bands) operates via radio frequency way past the IR range. To jam Lidar, you need a powerful enough IR light source (among other things), not a radio source. This is why its legal to make, purchase and own a Lidar jammer as the FDA (someone correct me if I'm wrong) controls the rules and regulations governing Lasers, and why its illegal to purchase or own a Radar jamming device, as that is controlled by the FCC who governs radio transmissions.
The article states, "when the officer pointed his speed gun at the car, the device failed to supply a speed reading."
Would it be possible to develop such a device that gives a false reading, rather than none at all? If so, I think it would be regarded as a laser malfunction & keep an investigation from taking place.
Yep!
Same as a radar jammer... illegal in most places.
"Destination Eternity" Garmin 765T, & Samsung Galaxy Note Edge
user of a lidar jammer in the u.k. lost his license...
That's a translation of the headline from Britspeak to colloquial American...
Driver of a speedy vehicle installs LIDAR jammer (Google "BLINDER parking sensor"). Gets nailed anyway. Rather than a (mere) fine, because of the jammer, he lost his license for a year.
Jamming/spoofing simple-minded doppler systems is pretty simple from a countermeasures standpoint. The more important issue, as this bloke learned, is judging the reaction of the folks who figure out that their systems are being jammed or spoofed. They are usually NOT happy!
Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
Need a portable unit so it
Need a portable unit so it can be hidden better if they run you down.
.
Lidar is very directional, so a portable unit (like a radar detector that sits on your dash or window) would not be very effective against Lidar (laser) as the police are taught to target the license plate first, headlights 2nd, and front of vehicle (hood/windshield) last.
Btw, Laser jammers are not illegal in the US as laser laws are under regulation of a different part of the government, not the FCC.
.
Btw, Laser jammers are not illegal in the US as laser laws are under regulation of a different part of the government, not the FCC.
While they may not be illegal to possess I'd bet real money that you would be charged with obstruction of justice if a cop operating a speed trap caught you using one - and I'll also bet that the judge would find against you because their use violates 'the spirit of the law' (which, of course is to allow the police to remotely determine how fast you are travelling).
We just had a case here where someone was using his cellphone wedged on his shoulder - now that isn't specifically prohibited, the law says you are not allowed to hold the phone in your hand.
The 'spirit of the law' was what the judge cited in his decision to uphold the charge - he admitted that while it was not technically aginst the law, it ran against 'the spirit'.
On the other hand I find it more than interesting that many people seem to now find it perfectly acceptable to wear earbuds while driving - and from what I can tell, many of them are listening to iPods and similar because they have them in both ears - and the police seem to be ignoring this.
Currently have: SP3, GPSMAP 276c, Nuvi 760T, Nuvi 3790LMT, Zumo 660T
Hearing
On the other hand I find it more than interesting that many people seem to now find it perfectly acceptable to wear earbuds while driving - and from what I can tell, many of them are listening to iPods and similar because they have them in both ears - and the police seem to be ignoring this.
The response I would have to this issue is if it is a requirement that you be able to hear in your car, why do we issue licenses to deaf people? I have not seen anything in the standard driver education manual that says you cannot be hearing impaired in order to get a license. Sight yes, hearing no. So it does pose an issue as to equal protection. If I can get cited for wearing earmuffs, such that I cannot hear anything, while driving and a person who cannot hear at all does not get cited, then there is a double standard at play.
My late father was quite deaf in his later years and often did not wear his hearing aids while driving. It was impossible to even carry on a conversation in those cases.
I support the right to keep and arm bears.
.
Keep in mind that deaf people are presumed to have learned to compensate for their disability in many cases, but people who are not hard of hearing have not.
So while I don't disagree with what you say, but there are statutes that preclude the use of headphones and such.
Currently have: SP3, GPSMAP 276c, Nuvi 760T, Nuvi 3790LMT, Zumo 660T
Presumptions and Spirit
Keep in mind that deaf people are presumed to have learned to compensate for their disability in many cases, but people who are not hard of hearing have not.
So while I don't disagree with what you say, but there are statutes that preclude the use of headphones and such.
How do you write presumptions into the law bramfrank? Maybe deaf people have learned to compensate for their loss of hearing but they still can't hear a horn, bell, siren or train whistle.
The laws against cell phone use while driving have nothing to do with using one hand to hold the phone. I don't know of any state where it is against the law to drive using only one hand. Those laws are about diverting the driver's attention away from his driving. Listening to the car radio or using a 'hands-free' cell phone would also be against the spirit of the law. That judge should be removed from the bench!
Presumptions and Spirit
@Jackj180
"The laws against cell phone use while driving have nothing to do with using one hand to hold the phone. I don't know of any state where it is against the law to drive using only one hand. Those laws are about diverting the driver's attention away from his driving. Listening to the car radio or using a 'hands-free' cell phone would also be against the spirit of the law. That judge should be removed from the bench!"
Ditto !!
And how about eating while driving? Or what about the 2000 watt boombox amplifiers blasting out at 150dbm? The point with cell phones and/or texting is that it requires, IMHO, much more attention which detracts from attention to driving.
Query
Out of curiosity - where does one buy a laser jammer?
RKF (Brookeville, MD) Garmin Nuvi 660, 360 & Street Pilot
Laser jammer
Also, what frequency do you use for modulation.
laser jammer
Out of curiosity - where does one buy a laser jammer?
Lots of places... according to Google.
Here's one:
http://www.1stradardetectors.com/laser-jammers/M47-Laser-Jam...
nuvi 1690 with ecoRoute HD, SP2610 (retired), Edge 305, Forerunner 405
earbuds, laser jammers--
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
Detecting a jam/spoof attempt gets interesting. If you detect a signal (CW or MCW) outside the range gate, that's an indication another transmitter is present. But deducing intent (is it another cop radar, construction equipment, or a jammer?) is a different story.
Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
Jammer devices
I'm an amateur radio operator (N8BSR). I can legally operate a transmitter in all of the ham bands here in the USofA. Each of the common speed-radar bands have close ham bands. I wonder what would happen if I had a modulated microwave transmitter operating from my car, in a band I'm licensed to use, while going through a speed camera location?
ear buds?
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
Detecting a jam/spoof attempt gets interesting. If you detect a signal (CW or MCW) outside the range gate, that's an indication another transmitter is present. But deducing intent (is it another cop radar, construction equipment, or a jammer?) is a different story.
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
hey jack
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
Hey Jack,
Read the exemptions again. Hearing aids are allowed in both ears.
Illiterate? Write for free help.
Yes but
CA Vehicle Code 27400 -- can't operate a motor vehicle or bicycle with both ears covered, headphones or earbuds. Specific exemptions for hearing aids, emergency vehicles, and similar circumstances. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27400.htm
So people who are deaf can't drive in CA? Or they can drive, just not wear ear buds?
Another example of a stupid law passed by people who think that passing a law automatically fixes a perceived problem.
Hey Jack,
Read the exemptions again. Hearing aids are allowed in both ears.
Yes but ear buds of an mp3 player aren't allowed. Neither are headphones.
So, people who are deaf can wear hearing aids while driving. They can take out the hearing aids and still drive. But they can't wear a mp3 player's ear buds. Does this make sense?
Ham operation...
yes, as hams, we can run 1.5KW on X band, and also on a good chunk of the 2.4 GHz band (think Wi-Fi and Bluetooth). We have close allocations on K and Ka as well, but generating enough power to pop someone's front end gets a lot more expensive.
On the other hand, as my good friend Johnny from the local PD says, "I can always write you up for a busted tail light..."
And as an emergency responder, I want these folks to know we're on their side.
But if you want to do something interesting, there are a lot of good monographs from Artech House ranging from the basics of ECM to more advanced fun and games with Doppler systems.
Nuvi 2460, 680, DATUM Tymserve 2100, Trimble Thunderbolt, Ham radio, Macintosh, Linux, Windows
.
laser jammer frequencies -- modulation frequency (or frequency offset) depends on the transmitter operating frequency and what you want the device to display. As an example, for 35 MPH kn K-band radar, you do calibration with a tuning fork that is quite audible. Google "radar doppler shift" for more.
I'm not exactly following you here.
Lidar operates via light waves in the Infrared range. Other types of speed measurement devices (radar in the X, K and Ka bands) operates via radio frequency way past the IR range. To jam Lidar, you need a powerful enough IR light source (among other things), not a radio source. This is why its legal to make, purchase and own a Lidar jammer as the FDA (someone correct me if I'm wrong) controls the rules and regulations governing Lasers, and why its illegal to purchase or own a Radar jamming device, as that is controlled by the FCC who governs radio transmissions.
Laser Jammer laws
Check out this link. It shows the states in the US that it is not legal to use a laser (lidar) jammer:
http://www.guysoflidar.com/usa-laser-jammer-laws.html
Double Tap
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/8077912/Speed-camera-jammer-banned.html
The article states, "when the officer pointed his speed gun at the car, the device failed to supply a speed reading."
Would it be possible to develop such a device that gives a false reading, rather than none at all? If so, I think it would be regarded as a laser malfunction & keep an investigation from taking place.
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