Red Light Cameras Ticketing Drivers Who Stop at Lights

Ok...technically he did enter the intersection prior to stopping but what ever happened to discretion. I don't see how issuing a ticket in this case does anything to enhance safety. This is clearly a case revenue generation and nothing more.

Reasonable drivers would reasonable in not turning right-on-red even after a full stop at RLC intersections. A ticket for future road rage incidents from motorists behind that car that won't turn on red?

If you watch the video, he didn't just cross the first white line for the crosswalk, he rolled to where he was blocking the whole crosswalk. I don't see any safety significance nor do I think he inconvienced any pedestrians but it seems like a clear violation to me. I think I would have paid too.

The "big-brother" aspect of the cameras and the blatant hypocrisy of talking about safety while drooling over money is annoying. But I think we all have some bad habits that could get us tickets if we get watched closely. Maybe it's not an entirely bad thing to get a reminder.

Jim

"...officials invariably point to the systems' failure to generate the promised amount of revenue as the reason for the change."

Safety? Ha.

I think people have gotten used to violating traffic light laws to the point of believing it is their "right" to continue violating the laws.

I would have to question the driver, and wonder if they were paying enough attention to stop if a pedestrian happened to be in/near the crosswalk?

So few drivers here in Albuquerque actually stop at the stop line that I rather suspect many of them don't even know that it has that meaning. Many of them stop in the crosswalk, and some well beyond. And many start creeping forward before the light turns green, encroaching yet further into what should be the protected part of the intersection.

I only wish that more enforcement by red light cameras and by policeman would adjust the social consensus in the direction of actually behaving the law here. The death rate from easily avoidable intersection accidents is wholly unacceptable and I think would be greatly improved if people just were more inclined to obey the existing traffic law.

I'd guess this is the intention of the Red Light Camera, forcing people to choose between obeying the law and going broke.

Hopefully, one day, you will learn that red light cameras are not about "Safety" or "Enforcement" or getting people to obey the laws as written, they are all about "Revenue Generation". In areas where they have been, but were taken out, the reason cited is that they didn't generate enough revenue. It had nothing to do with "Safety" or "Enforcement".

I'm retired and as my part-time job I am a School Cross Guard for Suffolk Co., Long Island. I have many drivers who stop in the cross walk or pass it and into the road where they don't belong.

This creates a problem for me when getting the kids across at the light. People shold know the law and stop where the BIG WHITE LINE is.

I say give them the ticket and then maybe their will learn where to stop.

I've seen cars in front of me who will not right turn on red at a red light intersection, I don't get mad at these people, these people and myself don't trust these right turn on red intersections with red light cameras.

I saw the flash went off at 0:05 but the car was not even at the crossing line yet. It looks more like the car is approaching at higher than normal speed (it does look kinda fast to me) and the camera sensor "thinks" that it is ready to run the red light without a complete stop; ergo, the flash goes off before the car crosses the 1st line.

Actually, they are about generating revenue by enforcing the law. Do you also believe there shouldn't be a monetary fine attached to a ticket you receive from a police officer for running a red light? After all, that generates revenue too.

When you took the driving test, you should know to stop behind the line at red light or stop sign. Not on it, nor a few inches past it. RLCs usually have radar or sensor aim at that line. So, if you stop on top of the line, you are likely to get a ticket. However, if you don't want to pay the ticket, there is always traffic courts.

We've all gotten used to some laws not being enforced. If there were an infinite number of LEOs those laws would be enforced by them but now technology is standing in for them. We all expect some judgement to be applied to differentiate between the "letter of the law" and the "intent of the law". Unfortunately, there are some cities that are apparently "rigging the game".

The light was already red so he should have stopped sooner.

This thread is in the wrong forum. I'll be issuing you (gwapaval) a "wrong forum ticket" to the tune of $480. You should know better!

I've heard of drivers not turning right on red at red light camera intersections. Good for them! I remember when turning right on red wasn't allowed, at all, ever, in Chicago. I think I'd rather go back to those days than be scrutinized to death for whether or not I stop correctly, according to a robot.

Does anyone here ever notice when they park, they might not exactly be in the center of the parking spot? Or they pull up way too forward, or not enough? When you get out of your car and judge how you parked, is it always perfectly? For me, no. Not always. So how on earth am I supposed to be able to judge whether the first inch of my bumper is beyond the white line? I used to drive so my front tires wouldn't cross the line. Then I reread the rules of the road and found out no part of my car should cross the line. I'm stopping. I'm not hitting pedestrians. But if I don't stop precisely, I'm breaking the law, equivalent to running a red light, and should get a reminder in the mail that I suck at driving. Getting a ticket will somehow improve my technique.

Pretty soon we'll be getting tickets for stopping too far behind the white line. I so want to delete that last sentence because I don't want to give the overlords any ideas, but I've decided to leave it because when it becomes a reality, I can say, "I told you so!" I want evidence!

Since the picture was already taken he should have continued with his right turn after all he paid for the right to proceed.

Gotta agree.
Drivers need to be retrained to stop earlier. I believe the law is usually 10 feet BEFORE the intersection/stop. Most people seem to cross the stop line.

My apologies twix.I do agree with most your comment. I hate it when other motorist doesn't take time to correct their parking in the lot between the line thus occupying almost 2 car spot. I'm taking in stride since I know nobody is perfect in driving. We try to follow to letter of the law but nobody is perfect. People are hypocrite when they said they never break any laws to be specific traffic laws.

In that video it sure looks like a double flash at least 5 feet before the "stop" line then a third flash as he crosses it.

In the Philly area every RLC I've seen is accompanied by a "No Turn On Red" sign.

As for the "stop line" there are a ton of sensor controlled intersections in my area, the old magnetic loop type in the pavement before the stop line, I love the people who pull up way past the stop line and wonder why the light won't change for them. A lot of the time the stop line is pretty far back so that trucks or busses can make a turn onto that street. There's one I know of that also has two signs by the stop line, one says "Stop Here On Red" with an arrow pointing to the painted stop line, and the other tells you if you don't the light won't change.
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I believe the first flash we see is for the guy on the left lane (not left turning lane) he is obviously has his front tires over the white line, the other two flashes are for the idiot turning right.

Was the same why in Collier County Fl. last year. You stopped but got a ticket - you went to court to fight it and the Traffic Lt. from the Sheriff would say - "oh you where on the white line, or you were stopped but over the white line, or if you show this film in slow motion it shows the wheel turned about a quarter of a rev so you ran the light" Since the state put down it's foot on right turns - this has pretty much dried up their extra revenue. It was never about saving lives - especially since the majority of camera tickets were for right turns on red.

The entire time the video is running the two cars on the left don't move, the only moving car is the one on the right. Unless there was a huge delay all three were activated by the moving car. The third flash happens almost exactly as he's crossing the white line, why would there be such a delay on the other section of the road?
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I have observed some intersections that one couldn't see the cross traffic without having to pull part way across the BIG WHITE LINE.. so there are situations and circumstances where following the law is more dangerous and not doing so.

Nuvi1300WTGPS

The main reason they want you to stop behind the BIG WHITE LINE when making a right rather than sliding right through is for the benefit of pedestrians than may be crossing or about to do so, we all know that behind the white line is not the best location to see cross traffic but they want you to make the initial stop there so you don’t run over aunt Edna, once you are sure she is not on the cross walk you can then move forward a little to a spot where you can see the cross traffic better.

Here in Clovis, the COPS sometimes stop with their rear wheels PAST the white line. Don't expect any enforcement when the cops are just as bad or worse.

I agree that bad example driving by policemen is as much a problem as lack of enforcement. Our Albuquerque policeman provide plenty of bad examples.

Maybe it's just me but it seems the first flash can be seen 'before' the Prius reaches the limit line. The second flash he's obviously rolled past the line. Tie goes to the driver?

It may take a photo when the light turns red to show that there are vehicles in the intersection at the time.

In Corpus Christi, they run video so you can watch yourself screw up. They also snap pics with a strobe so they can have higher resolution images of the driver and license plate.

None of our traffic cameras have improved safety. They've studied it and released that info. There are far more people that slam on their brakes when a yellow light appears, causing an accident. I try to avoid those intersections best I can.

What might be a good way to get rid of these.
I propose in the spring when the weather is nice all across the country on a Saturday or Sunday to have everyone drive to a red light or speed camera location and stop. This would happen at all the local locations. Everyone behind or to the side stop. Everyone get out and take their lawn chairs and BBQ's and start a picnic. Everyone bring some food and drink to make a day of it. If thousands of folks assemble at each location across the country and completely immobilize the towns and cities and do this a few times this year maybe we can get it done.

I will not turn right at a stop light with a camera. Heck with it.

has been less community minded. I've seen a number of photos of PO'd folks hanging demounted tires with gasoline in them & set them ablaze. Not exactly a pacifist approach, but somewhat costly to those owning & operating the cameras.

I particularly like a group of anti-camera folks asking for the position on cameras from their duly elected representatives, & make it an issue during elections.

Fred

Enough is enough...get over it and obey the laws and you won't have anything to worry about..boy talk about running something into the ground. You have the option of moving from the town, city, county, state, or country to get away from such an ordeal. If red light cameras are one of the most important problems facing us we have a real problem.

Get over it? Obey laws? Move?

I do obey laws, but I don't like having intersections made more dangerous so local governments can make money. There's something inherently wrong with that, and I'm sorry, I don't want to "get over it."

I should go through the expense of moving to avoid cameras? What if where I move installs cameras? Doesn't exactly solve the problem, does it?

In theory, you are supposed to come to a full stop before making the turn. I know it is thw law in New York.

In our area, if not most, the majority of tickets are given for right turn on red. Stop an inch into the white line before proceeding or slow to 1 mph with no traffic to turn on red and you are tagged.

Big revenue generator for the cities and villages. I have friends now that simply refuse to right turn on red where the cameras are present even though those behind begin honking like maniacs. Sign of the times.

The most recent intersection I reported, has little signs saying, "Right turn on red permitted after coming to a complete stop." I'm sure they put that there so they don't get people not turning right on red. Well, they should have thought of that before installing a "right turn on red" camera on a heavily traveled intersection. I wouldn't be surprised if our friends at the red light camera companies come up with the brilliant idea of handing out tickets to people that impede traffic for not turning. They'll get you stopping and going.

I refuse to turn right on red at intersections with a RLC, if I PO enough people behind me the better, if we get enough drivers to do the same the gridlock will make city hall rethink their scam tactics.

Well, at least here the law does say you have to stop prior to the crosswalk. As for waiting for the light to turn green, regardless of the law that's what I and a lot of people do. That's gotta be killing them-I don't wait 5 seconds, or 10 seconds, I just don't go. And most of the other people I've seen do the same thing.

My experience is the stop line is violated by most people in most locations. I have had to walk out into the intersection when crossing the street more times than I can count because some idiot is blocking the crosswalk. I wonder if I could sue if I got hit by crossing traffic? One time the guy was so far past the line, to stay between the crosswalk lines I would have had to go through his back seat.

I live in a city of over a million people and plenty of RLC's. Never heard of intersections being more dangerous with them. Those opposed to them make up all kinds of BS because they don't agree with having them. I personally think they are great. Catch those that don't pay attention and let them help generate income for the cities. I drive through two RLC's twice a day and have ne'er had or seen any problems in three years. Staying the proper distance behind the car in front of you and paying attention eliminates problems. I guess you would get to see a lot of new parts of the country..there will be more in the coming years not less so you may as well accept them.

Just noticed you're in Corpus Christi. Back in the '60's, or maybe the early '70's, I seem to recall that Corpus tried speed cameras, but when they got a picture of some powerful person in the car with somebody else's spouse, they discontinued the cameras!

While I agree with your post 100%, it is not worth pointing out here as it just ignites the flames as the red-light runner supporters will be attacking you very shortly.

Just because you've never heard of it, does not mean it's not true.

Those in favor of red light cameras make up BS because they do agree with them.

How do you propose having the car behind me keeping the proper distance so I can safely stop at a red light camera intersection?

You just cancelled out your own argument of moving as a solution.

And they did!!!! LOL

whats most disturbing to me is how much thought people put into rlc. why don't you just stop at all redlights and stop before the stop line and you won't get any tickets. I have rlc all around me and have yet to get a ticket.

AMEN!!!!!

Thanks for the video!

That would make too much sense.